a multiplayer game of parenting and civilization building
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I think this is a move in a good direction.
Another thing to consider is closing some of the gap that this causes for players. So if babies opt out maybe cause that to reduce their net birth timer. The damage is not just in them not staying and coming back, but also in not getting others.
jasonrohrer said he he going to try something else first, but I and several others here still think changing max lifespan could be a good incentive.
It doesn't have to be extreme to have an impact. To add a cost to suicide and other early death. Something that maxes lifespan out at 60, but bottoms out at 50 could still motivate some people.
And with how many babies suicide, believe me, YOU ARE MORE IMPORTANT THAN THE JOB I AM CURRENTLY DOING. I will happily choose you over that basket of milkweed I am carrying if needed.
I agree. It is a little strange to me that people think they are helping by opting-out when that is actually pretty rarely the case. That said I think most suicides are for more selfish reasons then this.
'suicided'
F wins for sure.
Some honorable mentions:
H
Hi
bby
baby
ty
Nooo!
WHY
sad
food
starving
berries
You can press up and down to go through your sentences, which means you can just say the naming and come back to it later instead of maintaining it in your writing bar
Brilliant. I'll incorporate that where I can.
I can't say for sure, but if he was indeed alone with you in the desert there may have been no other being by which the foulness might immediately egress. Even protected as you were by the ritual, should you travel and meet another who fails to perform it also there is risk.
The ghoulish hellion may have been able to insinuate itself into these unshielded people. Should this occur it will lie in wait for a sufficiently vulnerable vessel, no doubt to strike again. Without a final sealing of the abomination, there is no guarantee you boy's soul has escaped to his rightful place. As it stands, we can only hope that your actions were sufficient.
The fear you feel may yet be a clinging vestige of the ignoble shade, and can be alleviated by following the procedures listed under 'lingering doubts' in the guide. So long as you follow these directives thoroughly, you can be sure that all can be done, has been.
jasonrohrer wrote:2. On disconnect, server keeps your record alive...
Oh yes, finally, ... This change alone I think will be enough to help with the suicide problem.
I disagree entirely. It will help, and slow down the process, but I highly doubt it would be 'enough' by itself.
Just needs a special emote facial expression so that other player's know that that person is disconnected.
like /dazed or something. Good idea.
Kids need to jump, it's a life saving tool. Ok most of the time it's not needed but once the griefers know babies are trapped, kidnapping will increase.
Then perhaps only the mother should get the baby-lockdown effect, and lose it when she gets too old to feed.
The thing is you're going to be punishing new people a lot of the time by having this sort of system.
This can be alleviated with things like a grace period and playtime bufefr for new people.
Maybe 'very old deaths' or 'deaths so many lives back' stop contributing.
You also punish people who get neglectful mothers by luck of the draw.
It happens. Makes the lives you get a shot at surviving even more important.
As interesting as I think it is to have some sort of little reward to hitting max age living much longer with four bars probably makes you a hell of a resource drain. You'll be eating something every thirty seconds in a desert, fifteen seconds in a non desert biome, or every minute if on a perfect tile.
Yup. What are you going to do? Banish them? Murder them? Old people are a burden. Just die already, old man!
Plenty wander off into the woods to avoid leaving a mess as it is.
In terms of griefing, it would be surprising to see as relevant. A teenager can eat ALL the pies if they try really hard, so it's not like this is anything new.
What do you even use a person this old for? Writing long winded papers? I mean at least on the plus side popcorn is worth exactly three pips so you can eat without wasting food at that amount of pips.
They are good for tending berry farms if others haul the dirt and water in. Decent caretakers (with irl precedent), given said berry farm. Any non-essential cultural role. Any non-hauling role with close access to berries really. They are often a valuable reservoir of knowledge about the town and surrounding terrain, and get asked more frequently.
There is a concept in biology called 'the grandma effect' that postulates we live so long because of these caretaker / knowledge transfer benefits to society, villages with shorter lifespans dying out irl from institutional amnesia.
"Grandma we are starving!" ... "More berry bushes to the East."
As annoying as suiciding babies are, is it just the high child mortality humanity has suffered through up until the 20th century, and still have in some areas? It can be explained like that, but I certainly agree that not having girls to bring the lines forward is a bad idea. Maybe there could be a situational mechanic that counts the number of fertile females and if there is only one left the chance for having girls would be bigger if not guaranteed? It's a bit gamey and unnatural maybe, but honestly playability over realism any day.
I thought about that too, but I'd rather have random in-game diseases that only in-game technology could fix then biased player opt out.
P.S. - Sorry everyone. It started here.
Some people don't get to play often so consider that someone who has owned the game a long time and hasn't played much can still be very unskilled. So maybe having a grace period AND a playtime buffer at first could be a good thing.
I feel like it's gonna lean to punishing too much. Is it really that bad that people prefer different lives? Can't we support that instead of add rules that limit the players freedom to play the game like they'd like to? Is it really that important that everyone takes the first life they get?
I am simply after a situation where the babies born to me want to be with me most of the time. If one out of five doesn't want to be there, I don't want them to be there either.
I guess I have to bury the preference system dream...
It IS that bad when it results it distributed decision-making that PREVENTs some of those preferred playstyles from being viable!
Them wanting to be with you can be a result of them wanting to live longer in their next life, so this improve the chances you'll get what you want.
+1 on Life Expectancy, even as a nerf only. This makes death more meaningful AND gives you a reason to live! We need more reasons to live.
Yes people will calculate it but it tips the balance in favor of staying, so it still works on rational players. Adding more elements that tip the balance in the same way (more buffs / nerfs) will tip that further until it is in balance. Just make it expensive enough that it isn't a desirable option.
If it stops being a inevitable town-killing problem for everyone the occasional oddball suicide is much less important, so you might be able to say problem solved at that point.
Stay alive until BODY starves is a good thing, for infants and otherwise!
Slower babies might get more abandons by harsh travelling mothers who want to carry things. I had some take care of me contingent on me keeping up. If it only lasts 2-3 minutes though this is realistic.
How about an option to renounce your family as a means to start a new line? Abusable, but maybe this doesn't even have to break lineage, just changes your last name. The point being you need to be able to escape lineage ban lockout as a mother, so it would make lineage ban family name dependent. Also abusable... hmm.
Quality post good sir. I recently called your hotline, (555) EVL-BABY, but no one answered. Can you please help an old chap like me?
Certainly! I'm sure it was just a momentary hiccup. If you still aren't able to get through to someone on the hotline feel free to reach out to me via the email listed on the website.
Have your neighbors been complaining about thier toddler's head spinning around like a top while spraying viscous goo before exploding? Well you've come to the right place!
Hello, and welcome to THE complete and comprehensive guide on how to successfully and consistently drive out the twisted, black, wretched, EVIIIIL demonic spirits that are responsible for baby suicide.
For you to lay a binding curse on such a horrible creature, the unfortunate host will need to have a name. But infant suicide can happen very fast, and while you are busy with other important things. It is critical that you remain ever vigilant. The host must still be alive to receive the name properly!
Now normally people say "YOU ARE SOMENAME" when they are naming a baby. It is MUCH faster to type "YOURE A", which is the shortest possible working phrase. Work diligently to update this habit and practice often to save yourself precious time on each and every naming.
Don't believe me? Check out the scripture itself!
https://github.com/jasonrohrer/OneLife/ … hrases.ini
Prepare a paper list of names, male & female OR even better gender neutral. Cross them out as you use them to avoid duplicates. The more unique the better, because sometimes the name gets changed, either by appending a II, III or simply changing it.
Once it is clear the baby has a demon-inspired death-wish you can drop the pretense and just name it via a garble of letters, even just one letter.
It is best to confirm by hovering over them after or checking the bones, though it may not always be worth chasing the abhorrent baby-stealing cretin if it puts you in any real danger.
If you can't easily verify you can still fire off the C-Bomb with the name you said out loud and you might get lucky! There can't possibly be any adverse side effect to this action, so never let an opportunity to do so pass you by.
Naming is typically performed by first holding the baby and then announcing the name. This can be hard to do in some cases however because the once infested by unholy hellspawn the unlucky baby may bite, kick and struggle free. They can also waddle surprisingly fast.
Many highly reliable sources have even reported babies growing fangs, sprouting bat wings or having antediluvian sigils erupting from their flesh while they laugh hideously and speak latin in a harsh echoing bass voice. Don't be fooled though! A number of demons are far more subtle and clever than this, and you must keep a sharp eye out for any erratic behavior.
Rather the holding the baby, it may be sufficient to perform the naming while they are reasonably close by. This can result in the nearest nameless character taking on the name.
FUN FACT: this also works on nameless adult griefers!
As a precaution, make sure everyone in the village is in possession of a name at all times, to prevent any innocent bystanders from unintentionally shielding the possessing spirit from your cleansing ritual.
Many of these abominable spirits simply cause the poor child to run into the wilderness until nature consumes their frail body. As it turns out, these are actually the easier form to banish! A more insidious form of spirit-caused illness, known to some as 'Lowe Gout' can cause what appears to be instant death!
But with proper education and preparation even the terrible 'Lowe Gout' fiend can be cast back into the inky blackness of the starless void from whence it came. It turns out, though very fast indeed, there is a slight delay in such a death.
To overcome this you should, as a fertile adult female, have a complete naming ceremony fully typed in at all times. Before a baby arrives type in "YOURE SOMENAME", replacing SOMENAME with your name of choice. Continue play as normal, without hitting ENTER.
You must keep this typed at all times, removing it only to communicate with others. You may get unlucky enough to have an unprotected birth during prolonged dialogs, so be sure whatever it is you want to say is really worth risking your unborn baby's immortal soul over.
In fact, any and all males should also prepare this action, in case they spot an errant baby running past with uncanny speed and carrying on like a pack of auto-tuned hyenas. Have the teenagers and old-folks pitch in too!
Before any babies actually get born, you should practice reciting the naming ritual. That can allow for quick any easy recall later via the widely practiced 'upward arrow' technique.
Gender neutral names work well here, but in the case of an actual possession it does not matter if the name doesn't match the gender, because the poor little baby will not likely survive long enough to regret it.
Naming the baby as soon as it arrives pins the loathsome spectre to the body even if it slays its host within seconds!
Once the baby is named the ungodly beast within is anchored to the infant's body, and it is now possible begin a proper exorcism. Take your time, as the most time-critical part is over. You can even finish a brief task that you were about before, or grab a bite to eat.
Now, carefully and clearly type "CURSE", press the space bar once, the type the full name of the baby including any appended numerals. Press ENTER to begin the ritual proper. You can get a clue as to if this has taken effect if your voice gains a slightly resonant, angelic quality for a moment and you feel a rapturous feeling of peace, tranquility and general well-being welling up from deep within.
Now I know it can be confusing, some people even think that in sounds like you are cursing your own baby! That is of course, uneducated poppycock. As a seasoned professional in these matters I can assure you that it is in fact exactly and only the vile dark force that stole the poor innocent child away from you that is affected in this process.
The ritual is not yet complete however. You need to make sure everyone in the village repeats this exact phrase, accurate down to the last syllable and even character. Even a single person who fails to do so could unwittingly provide a gateway by which the hateful, sulfurous apparition might escape the righteous, purifying fire it so rightly deserves.
Once all members of your tribe, without fail, have spoken these words you can rest easy knowing that the darkness has passed.
If you have any lingering doubts, or experience feelings of 'grief', 'guilt', 'depression' or 'remorse' in the wake of losing your baby, you should consider applying these additional steps to make absolutely sure the child's soul is safe from eternal damnation.
Write down the full curse text on paper. Make multiple copies of this paper for distribution. Send horsemen and runners to neighboring towns and villages to deliver said papers and have their populations repeat the ritual, out loud in their own voice.
Maintain an archive of these papers so that future generations can maintain the seal that prevents the detestable vestige from returning to strike again. You might even make a sign to display outdoors, just in case.
Now I know some of you may be tempted to go about hoarding those precious 'curse tokens' for the inevitable jerkwad-with-a-knife-and-an-unpleasant-gleam-in-his-or-her-eye, but I implore you to think it through a little more. Once a mortal villan like this is properly executed, they aren't coming back within your lifetime. Everyone of proper schooling knows the 'Lineage Ban' prevents this, as laid out in the scripture.
These baby snatching demonic spirits, however, can come back again and again if you don't take proper precautions. So keep your holy water close and your list of baby names closer. Please, PLEASE, THINK OF THE CHILDREN!
With the rigorous application of these field-tested expert-certified techniques by you and your kin, it might just be possible to prevent large piles of dead babies from disrupting the daily workflow of your peaceful village once and for all.
Be sure to teach this very important skillset as the sacred tradition it is. We want it is passed on, through every generation of every family. Tell all your friends. Tell EVERYONE!!!
For more information visit our support page at evilbabies.org/exorcism or call our hotline at (555) EVL-BABY
We are always standing by to assist those in need!
You can purchase more of my award-winning books, as well as satisfaction-guaranteed exorcism supplies and merchandise at evilbabies.org/store
We are open to feedback as well as mention of any additional non-patented techniques that you may know about, so please feel free to reach out to us if you have anything to add.
Thank you for reading! -
How To Excise Demonic Sprits: The Complete Guide
By Snakeoil Witchdoctor II, "MD"
EDIT: thanks to Lum for pointing out the missing reference to the 'upward arrow' technique
tl;dr -
name all unnamed people
keep "YOURE SOMENAME" typed at all times
name baby immediately
type "CURSE SOMENAME" after suicide
convince entire village to also type this
So basically there are frequent silent apocalypses, 'Children of Men' style?
Sounds like this could be an artificial cap on how long you can keep a civilization going.
If he wants to make it harder, that is fine. Large percentages of people opting out randomly, without reasonable cause, is not a good thing and does not 'accomplish' that in a good way. New mechanics or tweaks can make it harder in ways that make sense in context of the game.
I do like the idea of building a baby-specific back-frame or sling to carry a baby, definitely a good idea. Lots of historical precedent. Adding tools does make certain things easier, but that is what all technology does. The game balance is unlikely to be shattered by this, if only because it will be a long, convoluted process that consumes resources like everything else in OHOL is.
In towns and cities that have everything the game IS (theoretically at least) easy right now. That is a bigger question to answer, how to make that engaging and challenging still, as you push higher and higher.
Some people are not satisfied with the state of play in developed cities, or in eve 'hard-mode' and right now this creating a major problem.
Karma and curses and other supernatural ideas were a huge part of our historical cultures. I see no problem adding them here, ESPECIALLY as they don't change anything visible within the scope of the character's life. It is purely meta, matters beyond the world of your little village, and something we always loved to dabble in despite not understanding how it all worked.
Another detail... it is awkwardly hard to curse infants who suicide. While you CAN name them them chase them down so you can see the name on their bones to curse them... It's just another wound your are letting them cause your family. Wasted food, time, productivity... maybe starvation or an animal attack. Making it possible to more easily curse them could help a little. I don't think it is enough though.
That blessing idea sounds like an unambiguous good thing, if similar to the curse system. I do not see that impacting the psychology of infant suicide significantly though.
It's pretty clear that the baby-suicide thing is becoming a real problem.
There are actually a lot of things you can do to detect common cases, but it is very hard to catch everything. People will find a way around most solutions.
The aesthetic problem is that they are not 'dealing with a random situation'. But the real problem is they are preventing OTHER people from playing the game in desirable ways, across a wide swath of playstyles. Killing family after family and colony after colony.
There are limits on the number of children you can have and nearly every family with I play now dies out quickly. Not because life is hard, or newbies ignorance, but because endless infant suicides. It feels unnatural and arbitrary, like some kinds of exploit-griefing do. Not like being gored by a boar, or running out of food and supplies.
If the player doesn't want to be there you can't change that. But right now that is costing resources in the form of a limited pool of offspring to the OTHER PEOPLE playing.
A human is born with a survival instinct that is hard to overcome. None of that applies here. We need something more contrived to close the gap.
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