a multiplayer game of parenting and civilization building
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MiniblueWarrior wrote:Spoonwood wrote:You can't have honest feedback without the possibility and actuality of negative feedback. You can't design a product which satisifies people if they are disaatisifed. Also, Jason asked our opinion in this case, so it's especially odd that you want to call people whiners.
Also, the person complaining cares. Apparently you don't realize that such a person exists.
I totally believe in negative and positive feedback, but it is not as if he himself is building the walls. The towns are. They are not mandatory, they are merely a feature. If he was making the game in such a way that every town just had walls no matter what that would be different. Its more like having a neighbor look at your yard and complain about your legally built fence than forcing said neighbor to build one himself if that makes sense. And as for the towns being closer, (that may have been another forum, but for the sake of example i will mention it) it is different to present the problems caused by close proximity vs. Saying "i dont like it its annoying". Feedback is constructive, negativity without any real reasoning or that is purely "I like to play this way and dont like other people playing any other way" is not feedback. Some people like their walls. So what?
I didn't complain about people building city walls, did I? "I like to play with people building city walls and don't like other people playing without city walls" has more lied along the lines of Jason's attitude. Take a look at what Jason says here:
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=6529
Here's some other quotes from Jason:
jasonrohrer wrote:But there are other things in that trailer that you currently don't see very much of in the game. Buildings. City walls and gates. Specialization.
jasonrohrer wrote:My vision for the game is to have those things occurring in the game, almost always.
jasonrohrer wrote:You don't build buildings or walls or gates in the game for one simple reason: YOU DON'T NEED THEM.
My vision for the game is to actually make you need such things.
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=6524
No, Jason doesn't want walls to merely be a feature. He wants you to *need* them. That's what he said, isn't it?
I wasnt really reffering to you, you and I tend to agree on things. But thats because we give real reasons. A lot of people on this thread are not doing that. Sorry if my previous comment came off as a blanket statement. Its just mere complaining without support only fuels his excuse that the players just whine. I agree with the problem, sorry if I came off as trying to shut down the conversation.
I think its safe to say that Jason's goal at the moment is not to make a game that the people who play it want, but rather a game where the players merely follow how he wants it played. It is not a rebuilding civilization game, it is an idea game, one where the ideas are random and do not match the idea of the trailer. The trailer shows the advancing of civilization through teamwork, creating little societies together and striving for further advancement amd survival. The game instead is one of constantly being reborn in random villages and having an hour to get to know everyone and the locations of everything while trying not to starve before doing it all over again. (The being reborn thing is cool, the always being somewhere random is not). It is a game of constant introductions and never any real connections. Its like taking the introduction phase of a roleplaying game with the struggle of a survival game and setting it on a timer, and once that timer is up it starts all over.
I think we all love the game, have ideas, and really want to see it do well, but Jason would rather act like we merely complain and dont contribute and are selfish. Its not a free game, of course we want it to be refined in a way we liked. It is a product, and one we want to help give ideas for. Jason doesnt have to be a one man team when it comes to testing the game, creating ideas, finding bugs, and getting feedback, but he chooses to be.
This is not a game for the consumer, but rather the developer. Of course our opinions wont be heard, as our job is merely to populate the game.
MiniblueWarrior wrote:Maybe people suicide till they "luck out" because they dislike never getting to progress in the same place and never get to have a real connection with a family. Starting over constantly is a real drag. I dont know how anyone is suppose to develop a connection with a family or really care for a towns survival when you leave for a new one every hour to do it all again.
I agree. But I will warn you that their exist indications that the game designer doesn't care about what other people think and feel at this point in time. That could change in the future, but I suspect that the game designer would just rather discover tricks to get you to play the way he believes you should play instead of fitting game design to accomodate his goals and people's desires.
Yeah in the end its his game. Its just a real shame since I feel it will never take off like that. I only really keep throwing that point out on the forums because it is a really well thought out and ambitious game but that aspect seems to bludgeon so much of the enthusiasm people otherwise have for it. I feel like if he gave it a chance he would find that people would love doing everything he wants them to do simply because they will feel like they truly have a meaningful existance in the game, rather than a fleeting glimpse of it bouncing across the map.
MiniblueWarrior wrote:Dude who cares? Walls, no walls, thats just an available option. Why do most of you "veterans" and new people complain so much. Dont build walls if you dont want walls. I dont agree with everything in this game, especially not this whole "new town every hour" idea, but why sit here and whine about something so stupid? And he wants his game to have more town interaction, so he made them closer. So what? And now you can build walls if another town is up to no good. Some of you need to stop whining and contribute ideas, not emotions.
You can't have honest feedback without the possibility and actuality of negative feedback. You can't design a product which satisifies people if they are disaatisifed. Also, Jason asked our opinion in this case, so it's especially odd that you want to call people whiners.
Also, the person complaining cares. Apparently you don't realize that such a person exists.
I totally believe in negative and positive feedback, but it is not as if he himself is building the walls. The towns are. They are not mandatory, they are merely a feature. If he was making the game in such a way that every town just had walls no matter what that would be different. Its more like having a neighbor look at your yard and complain about your legally built fence than forcing said neighbor to build one himself if that makes sense. And as for the towns being closer, (that may have been another forum, but for the sake of example i will mention it) it is different to present the problems caused by close proximity vs. Saying "i dont like it its annoying". Feedback is constructive, negativity without any real reasoning or that is purely "I like to play this way and dont like other people playing any other way" is not feedback. Some people like their walls. So what?
Maybe people suicide till they "luck out" because they dislike never getting to progress in the same place and never get to have a real connection with a family. Starting over constantly is a real drag. I dont know how anyone is suppose to develop a connection with a family or really care for a towns survival when you leave for a new one every hour to do it all again.
Edit: we paid for the game, if you try to tell me that we only get so many chances to play an hour or have to pay for lives then that would be wrong.
Dude who cares? Walls, no walls, thats just an available option. Why do most of you "veterans" and new people complain so much. Dont build walls if you dont want walls. I dont agree with everything in this game, especially not this whole "new town every hour" idea, but why sit here and whine about something so stupid? And he wants his game to have more town interaction, so he made them closer. So what? And now you can build walls if another town is up to no good. Some of you need to stop whining and contribute ideas, not emotions.
Honestly, i think the problem is that you want people to both 1. always have a brand new life in a brand new place, spend some time as a baby there, learn the places resource locations and needs, figure out a way to contribute and then die and do it again, and 2. to care about that place. While i agree it is interesting story wise, it makes it really hard for most people to have a sense of accomplishment and plan for the longterm when they know they wont get to keep watching that places growth and participate in its struggle. People naturally like to progress, not constantly be forced to start over in a brand new place and rush to relearn where everything is before they die.
That being said, i dont mean to be discouraging, this game has so much depth and genuine character, which makes it so special. I merely think the constant starting over in new locations really hinders the progress of the towns and the players as they never really have a place to call home and become attached to.
I have looked for a while for a game like this, and I cant emphasize enough how much i love the game, from the family lines, to being reborn after an hour, to the team effort and the freedom to make choices that will either result in prosperity or chaos. I love the idea of town leadership and and the challenge being so difficult it requires cooperation, that is honestly my favorite part. The depth of the crafting system is certainly outstanding.
That being said, and I am not trying to be negative, but the idea that I wont be able to continue with the same family and help it progress further without being lucky or continually committing suicide makes it hard to develop a connection or a sense of meaning to the family you are with. I am not saying the option to leave a family or be born to another shouldn't be available, but it would be nice to also have an option to rejoin the same family and continue to work towards the success of the town you have come to love.
I am by no means an experienced player and I typically don't participate in forums like these, but I just really enjoyed the experience so far and wanted to share my thoughts. I hope this game continues to grow and can't wait to see how it develops even further.
edit: I forgot to add, If I am being ignorant please let me know, my intention is not to be unaware.
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