a multiplayer game of parenting and civilization building
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Morti wrote:Just need more springs and wells.
Know your neighborhood, get those diagonal roads made.
Fastest way to travel.
a²+b²=c²well, actually they are same distance cause it's tile based
diagonals are just longer, even walking speed and horse speed is tile based, so basically 0-50, 50-0 and 50-50 are same distance from origo
sure, visually is 1.4... away but that's just optical
2d and isometric 2d is interesting this way, the focus is on strategy, that's why quite some strategy games are still 2d and popularthe space filling is interesting actually, the best way is hex maps, but then you got x,y,z
but actually you can determine every z using x and y so isn't more complex in reality
hexes got 6 adjacent tiles and diagonals are same distance as sideways
the other one is octagons and small diamonds on diagonal
a few games use that model, like civilization series, wesnoth, and was some kickstarter 4x game which was quite famous, endless legend? or something like thatbut yeah, diagonal roads got the advantage of fast roads not pushing you if you don't want to, as it wont autorun if you don't click a tile on it while standing on it
Going 0,0 to 0,50 to 50,50 has got to take more time than going diagonally from 0,0 to 50,50. I think Morti might be onto something here.
btw the title of the this thread must be facetious? You're pointing out an error, not breaking the game. Don't be overdramatic.
Just experienced this. Ate a mushroom for yum chain around ~50. Got randomly shot by arrow while standing by fire, died at 52, luckily the "trip" was already winding down because.. Next life the hallucinations continued. For interests sake, every time i (or anyone) gave birth and then picked up the baby, a tile-sized yellow square appeared over top of the baby, stacks of baskets appeared as piles of bones on top of a basket. Later i thought i found a bunch of balls of thread in the wilderness, "oh i guess someone's griefing" I thought. Turned out they were fertile soil deposits. The hallucinations persisted into the third life; I was born to a Mom who was in the midst of planting the farm. I watched as she planted several red hearts out of a bowl, later i discovered the occasional weird-looking bean plant i found was actually a thread. There was a few other weird things. I think when i decided i was completely over it might have been when i walked out of the kitchen to see about a dozen geese half sunk into the ground, though i feel like it was something just before that which was hindering me in a more practical way.
I noticed this thread before and assumed it was something that had been fixed. tbh i actually didn't mind it persisting the second life, it was kinda amusing as well as a little inconvenient, but by the third life i was done with it after a bit.
The safest way to deal with griefers is just let them grief, unfortunately.
It can be annoying sometimes, for sure. Try to think ahead and limit your exposure. For example one time, before I died of old age, I was passing a backpack w/knife to a trusted daughter, but some kid read the situation and ran up and snatched it. I was annoyed at the time but it could have been prevented if we took an extra second to go somewhere less crowded. If you have something important for a task, leave it where you can see it or put it where few will. Cut up your rabbits at the edge of town and bring the ball and thread with you before laying out the backpack. Feed all your sheep, then shear them all at once after gathering the supplies. I'm not saying this will prevent it 100%, because it won't, but at least putting those extra steps makes it so someone who just happened to be walking by with a ball and thread in their BP doesn't come across a ready to make backpack to give to their baby while you're out looking for a ball and thread yourself.
Also, realize that people can't read your mind. And have patience. It's not always obvious if someone is using something or if it's just sitting there waiting to be used.
Just got the same thing. Normally when this happens i close the game, steam quickly updates, then i can play again. But I close steam and nothing happens, just rinse and repeat.
Jason's attitudes that a 10% murder rate is just about right is why I don't play the game anymore and haven't for over a month or two.
He doesn't consider that some of the death by starvation/animal comes after a person witnesses a murder spree and suicides in frustration.
If I watch my village killed, the people I grew to trust savagely decimated, I don't want to keep going on there and just starve or go stand on a snake.
And right there is proof that 10% is a lot more murder than Jason believes...
In English, the word decimation is used to express a horrible loss of a fraction of something. It is derived from Latin, decimatus, which was executing every tenth man chosen by lots as punishment.
A 10% loss of something is considered so traumatic there is a word used to describe it. Just let that sink in, Jason.
A 10% homicide rate is NOT normal or just about right. It's terribly high and makes the game unplayable.
Our language reflects this loss by one tenth is horrific, so why won't you accept that 10% is way too high?
decimation
1. to destroy a great number or proportion of:
2. to select by lot and kill every tenth person of.
So the game is in a constant state of 'decimation' then.
There's also bear griefing. Played a life on Tuesday where someone kept luring bears to town, lots of people died to bear wounds. Midway through the life a pair of villagers stole the bow and a cart of supplies. I chased after them with my knife, but I stopped at the edge of town realizing that I was basically running into an arrow if I kept following them. I saw two babies (one mine) at the fire talking about killing everyone, I debated killing them, but didn't want to start a chain reaction. Two more bows were made to fend off the intermittent bear attacks. Some villager returned during a bear attack and starting freaking out about where the bows had gone, not knowing there were bears in town. My mom distracted a bear so I could run away and she got bit, which was really sad since I knew what to do to avoid it.
Overall it was an interesting and memorable life but the level of paranoia and distrust among players is really high. You spend your life working next to a bunch of people not knowing if you can trust them or not. Is your nephew Zeke gonna be a homicidal maniac a few years down the line, or is he just a little quirky? Unfortunately your options aren't good if you want peace and only to kill if it's needed to defend the peace. You don't have a chance to question people's intentions a lot of the time, you either have to kill them preemptively or let them run off and be free to do the damage you suspect they might. There's been countless times where I didn't kill someone, feeling like I needed a little more information first, only to see them later killing off the sheep and running off with a cart full of iron (for example). But if you kill them preemptively then you're probably gonna get killed in retaliation by someone and quite likely start a chain of murders as people continually wander into the scene and see a family member has just died and decide they should get revenge.
I guess what I'm saying is it feels like it's advantage griefer, you don't have a great way to deal with them short of carrying around a bow, which is also a good way to get yourself killed since you will be seen as a threat and also not working. It's a barrier to connecting with other players. Time and communication is limited so we don't just stand around chatting with each other to build trust like in real life. And the result is everyone ends up paranoid and on edge.
In the life I shared at the start of this post no one was murdered by another person that I can recall, but the feeling of chaos and helplessness was similar.
I love when people do silly dances and other silly things. It can be so adorable!
It's hard for me to say since I started a little over a week before swords were added. The killing frenzies have decreased I think since they were first implemented. The language update is kinda moot though because of the sword. I think it would have been better to do the language update a few weeks before the sword at least to allow people to get used to overcoming hurdles to cooperation one at a time.
I agree that it would be a good idea for Jason to hire a team, in particular it would be good to have some voices in the room that are familiar with sociology, history, and other areas that are very relevant to the game, as he doesn't seem to have a background in these areas which is a handicap in being able to judge what effects changes will have, or what needs to be added to facilitate certain things (like trade and property) that Jason seems to desire to have in the game.
Some of this information is available on this forum already, but I think in this situation it would be better for Jason to pick those voices himself so he can choose people he respects and trusts and not feel like he's losing power and control, or bending to every whim of the community.
Good/bad mom's will even out. Everyone will get this about as much so it cancels out.
A good change to make the system better reflect your "gene fitness ability" would be to only include family members who were alive at the same time as you.
That's already how it works.
ollj wrote:yellow fewer is mostly harmless if:
- you move slowly
- you avoid trees or cut down trees that occluse jungle (really, its the trree occlusion that is evil, not the things that kill you from behind the trees)
- you do not go off alone and are not too far from anyone else (nearly impossible while building roads)
- you try to not die like a newbie (i keep diing to yellow fewer while building roads a lot, like a newbie)
- you are under the muschroom effect (this usually makes mosquitos much more visible)How is it that you haven´t been moderated for trolling already? lmao.
Generally I'm not a fan of ollj's posts, but this one is actually a good post imo. He isn't trolling here and is actually giving useful advice, though I'm personally not sure about the mushroom one. I used to die to mosquitos a lot when I was new, but now I'm more careful and usually don't anymore. Just go slowly in jungle and avoid running behind trees too much.
Looking forward to some new characters!
Lol, someone's salty. Was expecting something more like the second half of multi-life's post. This was a humorous read.
I like to think the average player goes around town looking to help, but isn't always able to identify a task that needs to be done or doesn't have the knowledge to complete it. If that happens they might stand around chatting or get up to mischief or run off into the wilderness and starve.
Saolin wrote:It would be interesting if there was something special that could be done only in late game towns, like some kind of event or social gathering of some kind. Not really sure what, but something that a group of players could participate in. I don't like the murder fests really, but ironically some of the more interesting late game experiences I've had involve some kind of drama. It would be cool to have another way to facilitate this other than someone starting a string of murders.
Often there isn't much left to do and the town can support players that just hang around eating, so it would be interesting if they had additional ways to occupy themselves in late game other than building mostly useless toys that most people probably don't even know how to make.
I think some things can be done but ultimately still pretty limited, on top of my head I can think of
Arena - Now that magic aim is there i'm not sure this is even feasible. Two contenders go into the ring , that split in the middle with a stone wall(maybe a 6x8 size?) - Iron is there, and two kilns, with all the basic materials to craft a knife and a pick-axe (to break the wall with) from scratch laying around - first to stab the opponent wins - so i guess this more of a speed crafting competition
for humanity's sake - pad and sutures will be provided at the end of the game.... or not ... at least it was fun while it lastsHorse racing - an enclosed track for horse-racing purposes - would be cool if one could bring rattle snakes to dot the racetrack to add some spice - but i guess making rattle snakes containable is grief prone
Theaters - for drama queens and RPers , two stone pillars, a stage of 1x5 wooden floors, fronted by property fences - can actually include murders but well staged up so as to not upset nearby people - pads optional - sorry I don't want to know what happens to the actors anyway xD
People have been talking about arenas on here for a while though and it never happens - much easier to just pick up a knife and stab. I'm not disagreeing with the ideas you mention, just pointing out there's a lack of incentive to work on them.
The dystopian nature of late game cities is a comment on reality in some ways, but we also have other beneficial luxuries as a trade off in reality. In this game the only real benefit is yum-chain. There's other luxury items, but they often are not an improvement or actually worse than the alternatives.
I like the idea of having an in-game poll. Internet forums disproportionately draw certain types of people. Some player types are likely not represented much, or not as willing/likely to share their opinion. Gives everyone an equal voice.
It would be interesting if there was something special that could be done only in late game towns, like some kind of event or social gathering of some kind. Not really sure what, but something that a group of players could participate in. I don't like the murder fests really, but ironically some of the more interesting late game experiences I've had involve some kind of drama. It would be cool to have another way to facilitate this other than someone starting a string of murders.
Often there isn't much left to do and the town can support players that just hang around eating, so it would be interesting if they had additional ways to occupy themselves in late game other than building mostly useless toys that most people probably don't even know how to make.
I could see myself feeling the same way... The thing is just thinking about the math, there's pretty much no way I could run out of lives, even when it was still 12. So I just don't worry about it and it doesn't effect my game.
Shame on you, no one deserves to have to try to raise quadruplets.
I had my lineage last 36 generations after me, every member of the family alive then was descended from me.
My Mother was AFK, and I only lived because a Male made sure I stayed fed.
Yes, but the male has nothing to show for that. Their life-log would be the same if they went on a killing-spree and murdered 6 people in cold blood. In addtion, if they lived their previous life as a female, it is quite possible they'd come into conflict with their current family, which could potentially end the lineage of their female life. They have nothing to gain by being altruistic, and can only possibly lose.
So the only measure of success in this game is lineage length. If you are born a male you are not able to accomplish this goal at all; your lineage ends with you. Since you will be born female an equal amount of the time, doesn't it make the most sense when born as a male to sabotage the lineage as much as possible if it's not shared by a previous female life? In order to maximize your relative level of success, and avoid competing with your old lineage?
lol, haven't you been born to mother-on-horseback countless times by now?
Seriously though a male baby is basically worthless unless it's supporting your female babies.
I still don't get why people were complaining about grain clutter, just take that to the bakery. there's usually supplies to make pies, and if not, bread is a decent option. I'm always annoyed when no one made bread to extend my yum-chain. I've never had a problem where grain got in the way.
Milkweed on the other hand? I've started scouting my towns for milkweed, and if we don't have at least 6-8 going i'm looking to plant that asap, and if we don't have seed i'm looking to make sure we get at least one bowl of seed. I can plant 8 of those and it just vanishes without me using any of them, hopefully able to be resurrected with immediate attention to plant some more since the seed disappears so quickly.
Perhaps if the leftover plant material from milkweed deteriorated more quickly/immediately so it could be replanted less awkwardly, and the seeds lasted longer? (it feels like they're the quickest seeds to deteriorate)
On a semi-related note, I love the slot-boxes. I think people have tended to ignore the fact you still have to pay for the 4 baskets with resources in order to make a normal box better vs 1 thread and a saw use. Obviously it's way more convenient to use also.
I've only been stabbed at random, and it sucks (or shot with an arrow). It was nice before the last dance update, where i was always able to evade in those scenarios. It doesn't really bother me if i get killed, though i will often curse the player who does so (since to this point i've always been innocent). It does make me increasingly tempted to randomly kill others though.
I don't see this going well. People would just leave the game rather than sit there, and I have a feeling it would mostly be used to torment the innocent.
futurebird wrote:He didn't say that having 0 births as eve was griefing he said that Eve's who grief want to have no kids because they get in the way.
You're right that I misread his statement. Your interpretation seems plausible. Looking at what gotten written again, I find it strange that the 'unless' lies there.
Saolin wrote:There isn't close to enough players to support 1000 eves per day. Unless you're a griefer who wants to have 0 births as eve.
Oh... is what meant something like the following:
"There isn't close enough players to support 1000 eves per day. Unless you want only griefers who wan to have 0 births as Eve."
Or maybe the 'unless' refers back to the first sentence (which would an unusual grammatical form)
"This is just wrong and you know it, spoonwood. Unless you're a griefer who wants to have 0 births as eve. There isn't close to enough players to support 1000 eves per day. "
The number of a 1000 didn't get used by either you or myself futurebird.
Anyways, back to what you said.
You said that families lasting long was an issue. But, I don't agree that lineage length qualifies as a big concern with respect to the fundamental concepts of parenting and civilization building. Lineage length is a means to motivate people to engage in constructive play involving the fundamental concepts. At least that's how I interpret what Jason has written from the following:
jasonrohrer wrote:The core idea in this game is that you care for your offspring because they are the future that gives what you accomplish in the game meaning.
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=5806
But lineage length isn't the only means. Eve chaining exists (technically it exists on bigserver2, but there's a very short time period where it can happen during an update and who knows if anyone who lived to 60 as an Eve logged in within the right time frame... with respect to that I note that a few weeks ago I managed to jump in after quickly using /die on server1 during an update period and got reborn in the same spot where I had died in previous life... soon after the camp was bigger and got griefed by the time I Eve chained back to there... so it's possible to Eve chain on bigserver2 for a very short time period, even if it hasn't happened and is more difficult now). Thus, lineage length seems only to be an issue in terms of how much people's feel of lineage length on a server motivates people to play constructively to fulfill the fundamental concepts of survival, parenting, and civilization building.
But, there's also the issue of how much parenting and civilization building go on at any time (to what degree are people playing according to the fundamental concepts). From what I can tell, Eve camps almost invariably have parenting and civilization building go on to an appreciable degree, while it's less certain in later generations, because civilization maintainence comes into play and doesn't exist in an Eve camp.
Really, the number of Eves should only be a problem if
1. They are too likely to be griefer Eves.
2. Eves trying to play constructively aren't having at least one child who will also play in accordance with the fundamental concepts/constructively (note... the child does NOT have to be a girl).
3. Players will stop playing or start griefing, because they can't find anything else and won't play Eve camps.
At least that's my take on it so far. When do you think the number of Eves should and should not be a problem?
Hmm i didn't realize this post existed at the time of my previous response. Yes Futurebird accurately communicated to you what i meant. Now that you've explained what you meant i will admit you have some good points as long as enough children are available to non-griefer eves.
To answer your question: I think it's too many eves if they're forced to compete directly for resources with each other / nearby towns to the extent that the only realistic option is to join forces or attack (it would always end up in a slaughter at some point anyway), or if they don't get to birth any/enough children to have a chance to build a lineage. It could be as many as a few kids, as long as those kids are tending to stick around. I am also not fond of the idea of eves being able to continually re-spawn as a recurring griefer.
Saolin wrote:Spoonwood wrote:Nope. More people are needed to fulfill the fudamental concepts of civilization building and parenting. More people being an Eve and trying to start a family and build up to a town means more players likely to fulfill the fundamental concepts of parenting and civilization building.
This is just wrong and you know it, spoonwood. There isn't close to enough players to support 1000 eves per day. Unless you're a griefer who wants to have 0 births as eve.
I said what I believed. You can tell yourself that you know my own mind you want all day long, but that won't make you right. In my opinion people are often bad at reading minds... especially those outside of their social circle, and I've found this the case rather consistently in my life with my own mind.
Having 0 births as an Eve is not griefing. That's simply preposterous, because griefing is something a player does, while having babies is something that happens to the player.
Wanting anything is also not griefing. Wanting is an emotion, while griefing is the behavior of a player in game.
Have a nice day or night as the case may be.
Lol you completely ignored my point. So do you think we have the player base to support 1000 eves per day?