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a multiplayer game of parenting and civilization building

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#126 Re: Main Forum » Food Consumption vs Temperature » 2018-05-17 15:51:29

Btw, I put in a new suggestion on the Reddit forum, about adding "Freeze to Death" and "Thirst" as new death reasons which point at the need to control body temp. Vote for it if you would like to see it happen.
https://www.reddit.com/r/OneLifeSuggest … ive_death/

#127 Re: Main Forum » Food Consumption vs Temperature » 2018-05-17 14:57:26

I'm taking a deeper look at the temperature calculation (heat map) and it looks to me as if it's broken. Not completely broken, but enough to mess up what I believe is the intended effect with body temperature and the temperature of one's surroundings.

What we know is:
1. You will consume more food if you are too cold or too hot.
(good design, that means we can use technology to reduce our food consumption)

What we don't know is:
2. Exactly how should you play in order to keep a good body temp?
(unless you are next to staircase desert biome, which is a pretty daft requirement for survival)

I can cover myself completely in rabbit fur, but only see a marginal difference to my temperature. This makes no sense if the intention is to incentivize use of clothes.

Looking at the code I see that it's using a heat conduction model, which is really not the best model for a human in the wilderness, and my guess is that this is the source of the unintuitive behavior. I will actually spend some time to develop an alternative implementation, then reach out to Jason and see if he would like to use that one instead.

#128 Re: Main Forum » New Player Feedback » 2018-05-15 08:03:13

breezeknight wrote:

abandon all your babies until you've learned to survive 3 times to 60

I feel that this is horrible advice, breezeknight. I get what you mean with it (that the new player should learn everything on his/her own without having to care about anyone else), but it's counter to what the game is about (cooperation, taking care of other's needs, aiming for slow but steady progress). The real skill to learn is how to take care of kids and inexperienced players and still survive. Doesn't matter if it takes longer, because it's more fun for everyone and it's a unique experience in gaming, which is getting lost if people play like you suggest here. Yes, I see that you mean it as a learning phase, but what you would learn from that phase (and what people trying to play as your baby would learn) are not the right things.

mikechar wrote:

There is a kind of denial of service attack against new players, or players who want to play differently -- kill them.

You are putting words on what has been nagging me. It's a sad reality that many of the players who are actually loving (or love/hating) OHOL the most, are also inadvertently taking an active role in stifling the growth of the user base. Not all the time, but often enough. I would very much like to see the user base grow. Kill babies, code words for experienced players, kill inefficient players, ignore teaching... all of these methods are sucking the lifeblood out of the game and user base.
As Master Yoda says: The Dark Side is not stronger, only quicker, easier, more seductive. Power gamers: join the Light Side.

Please don't be offended. You have the right to play how you wish. If you're active on the forum you probably have a vested interest in seeing the game grow though. It's through the new players that can happen, and through your positive attitude towards them. This attitude cannot only show in the forum and Discord, it needs to show in the game itself.

My 2 cents.

#129 Re: Main Forum » Family tree is pretty sweet » 2018-05-11 22:03:15

TrustyWay wrote:

So many boys in family trees, that is the worst

Would be great if males got a way to contribute to the family tree. Adoption of nameless players could be one way. Bringing someone over with a wedding band, perhaps? That someone would show up in two family trees after that. Isn’t the game a lot about relationships with new people, after all?

#130 Re: Main Forum » Confessional » 2018-05-10 20:00:48

We’re porting the game client to iOS and Android. Soon the world will be full of people playing the game on touchscreens and all of you will be regarded as secondary players, probably made fun of and being called “mouse people”.

Sorry about that (but not very...)

Also, I once kept eight kids in a game. Not sorry about that at all. Kids for the win!

big_smile

#132 Re: Main Forum » A little poem for you all » 2018-05-09 20:38:08

Artarda wrote:

Unnamed Haiku
Some haiku are good
Some haiku just don't make sense
Refridgerator

Lol

#133 Re: Main Forum » I love this game! THX » 2018-05-02 14:08:28

Dust wrote:

Next great moment:

I had 2 sons 1 daugther, told her she needed to keep the next girl, or it's over.
She get's a girl, we run out of food, she dies.
Me and my sons try hard to find some berries and to feed the baby.
Baby thinks it's alone and runs of to die.

GG

Lol, no good deed goes unpunished. smile

Next time, pick up the baby and carry her with you on your berry run. Please continue to post your adventures and mishaps!

#134 Re: Main Forum » The role of males in the game » 2018-05-02 13:57:06

I would suggest to give males a possibility to help the family line along.

First some math:
In real life, a family tree grows through childbirth and marriages, and through both men and women. In OHOL we have the situation that only childbirth and only women grow the tree. If we simplify significantly, we can estimate that it is _at_least_ twice as hard for a OHOL family line to survive to a new generation, than a real-life family. This means that for a OHOL line to survive for another 10 generations is 1000 times more difficult than in real life, and 100 generations is 10^30 more difficult to achieve (which means that it will never happen naturally).

Special male-only feature: adopt a stranger into the family line.
This would not change normal game-play but it would impact the long view, for players who are interested in that.
The mechanism could be something like this: 1. A male takes a certain object in hand and says "You are (name_of_family)", and drops the item. 2. The player who wants to join the family picks up the item and says "I am (name_of_family)". The item could be a leaf or a bone needle (alludes to mixing of blood) or something.

What do you think?

#135 Re: Main Forum » Look... people... » 2018-04-28 14:17:13

+111 to original post of this thread!

#136 Re: Main Forum » How tool decay will work in the update » 2018-04-27 23:10:10

Looks like he chose the one I was writing about, so you can have another look at that. It’s not a bad solution at all. The way I read Jason’s explanation, he is saying that both fully random and fully determined are worse solutions than what a combination of them is. I for one agree with that. For one thing, it’s more realistic. Let’s try it out and see if it feels good. Otherwise I’m sure there will be new updates.

#137 Re: Main Forum » Randomizing tool breakage? » 2018-04-26 09:44:10

Flintstone wrote:

tldr: using 2 or 3 stages for an item to break or decay gives an element of chance combined with a nice probability curve

Back with graphs here.

The curves show probability for a new item to remain unbroken until its x'th use and then break (x-axis: 1 to 100, y-axis: 0% to 2.5%). The average number of uses before break is around 40 for all the curves.
Blue:     Item (1/40)=> broken
Red:.     Item (1/20)=> Stage1 (1/20)=> broken
Green:   Item (1/13)=> Stage1 (1/13)=> Stage2 (1/13)=> broken
Orange: Item (1/10)=> Stage1 (1/10)=> Stage2 (1/10)=> Stage3 (1/10)=> broken

Personally I think the Green curve looks like a sweet spot. Adding more than 2 extra stages yields diminishing returns.

#138 Re: Main Forum » Randomizing tool breakage? » 2018-04-26 01:09:59

tldr: using 2 or 3 stages for an item to break or decay gives an element of chance combined with a nice probability curve

Lily wrote:

I would split the difference. Make say 3 versions of a shovel, and give each a 5% chance to move to next step. So shovel 1 has 5% chance to become shovel 2, shovel 2 has 5% chance to become shovel 3, and shovel 3 has 5% chance to become a broken shovel. You can set the percentage to whatever you want but your guaranteed to have at least 3 uses before it breaks. Getting a few extra uses isn't a big deal but having a tool break on the first use would be extremely frustrating. So we rule that out. It adds a bit more to the database, but 3 shovels is way better than 40.

This concept was described in more detail in https://www.reddit.com/r/OneLifeSuggest … _easy_way/ as a way to model decay. It's also good for modelling tools breaking from actions, because it has the non-apparent mathematical property of bunching together probabilities in the middle and shortening the tail.

Let me explain by example:

1. An axe is given 1/40 chance to break at each use.
Probability for an axe to be used exactly n times before breaking:
1:2.5%, 2:2.4%, 3:2.4%, 10:2%, 20:1.5%, 30:1.2% 40:0.93%, 50:0.72%, 60:0.56%, 80:0.34%, 100:0.20%, 200:0.02%
(an axe is likelier to break on the first use than on use number n, for any n != 1)

2. An axe is given 1/20 chance to turn into battered axe, while a battered axe is given 1/20 to break
Probability for an axe to be used exactly n times before breaking:
1:0%, 2:0.25%, 3:0.48%, 10:1.5%, 20:1.9%, 30:1.7%, 40:1.4%, 50:1.0%, 60:0.75%, 80:0.36%, 100:0.16%, 200:0.002%
(an axe is likelier to break on use number 20 than on use number n, for any n != 20, n != 21)

(a graph would have been nicer, I confess wink )

Adding a third stage would increases the probability effect further. If you want a probability for tools to break from age as well as from use, you could add a 1/20 chance for transition every 60 minutes as well...

#139 Re: News » Update: From Riches to Rags » 2018-04-25 21:29:50

Ayala wrote:
wooblyman wrote:

Sorry man, I don't like this update. I like the concept, but I think focusing on what the game is about a bit more would be nice. The whole concept of the game in your intro video is what we do lasts FOREVER! and now it all decays and doesn't last for long at all?  Low blow as far as I'm concerned. lowest of the low. that concept of legacy is why I paid money for your game. The apocalypse was marginally fine, but this is stupid. please fix this update, I believe that it ruins the game too much, what we make in the game should last as long as you told us it would in the intro video.... forever (unless there is an apocalypse). Big fan of the game and would hate to see it die.

I was thinking about that, but come on, a basket can't be anyone's legacy, at least not one that lasts forever, I'm ok with bigger, more meaningful things being one's legacy, like a monument or hall that was constructed by people eating from your farm, a crown, a well, etc. A basket is a helpful item, making baskets is a helpful job, but it shouldn't be so easy to have your legacy last forever.

Agree that woven baskets are not much of a legacy to strive for wink

I think it's good and proper if baskets decay after one lifetime or so. Real buildings is more of a legacy. They should also decay at some rate, but be possible to maintain.

The truest legacy you leave behind you in this game are children, knowledge and companionship. If time did not chip away on what we build, this true legacy would have little impact on the results of the game. Building games are a dime a dozen, but this game is something else. I know of no other game that shows mutual benefits from collaboration better than 1Hour1Life.

Those of you who are up in arms protesting the updates, please take a step back and contemplate: It's not about what you build, but about how. Do you want to leave baskets behind, or smiles?

#140 Re: Main Forum » Decay is great. BUT. » 2018-04-24 08:43:07

YAHG wrote:

Need decay to make the professions beyond farmer tenable though..
It really sucked when you finally learned to smith and the village NEVER needed your skills again.

Spot on!

#141 Re: Main Forum » Weird meta-idea: stuck in a life for an hour » 2018-04-18 21:47:30

miskas wrote:

Go for the Curse dance on the grave cause this will make the victim/perpetrator afraid and cooperative ( someone proposed the option to bleed your hand with a needle and touch the grave to curse it. the more the curses the more lifetimes/time have to spend as a hermit)

Three arcane judges with blooded hands should definitely be able to utter a curse/judgement over a player, either alive or recently deceased. Why? Because it would be hilarious!

However, as everyone knows, a dying person can also use his death curse on his killer. So in the case of a murderer, there can also be a single judge. The dying person would have to say the curse before dying and there would be three choices (of course, these things always come in threes, duh!)

First, the beginning of the curse: "WITH MY DYING BREATH I COMMAND". Then the choices:
1. "I CAST THEE OUT" - the cursed player is moved 5000 cells i a random direction, and will have to spend the rest of his life in the wilderness. big_smile
2. "HUNGER FOR JUSTICE" - the cursed player's hunger boxes are reduced to only four for the rest of his life. He'll have to eat all the time big_smile big_smile
3. "CHANGE YOUR WAYS" - the cursed player will walk backwards for the rest of his life, to the ridicule of his peers. big_smile big_smile big_smile

In the case of the three judges, the words are slightly different, and they all have to speak one part in sequence (after bloodying their hands):

Judge 1 starts the chant "WITH OUR LIVING BREATH WE COMMAND"
Judge 2 utters curse number 1, 2 or 3
Judge 3 completes the chant with the words "WHAT HE SAID" (or "WHAT SHE SAID", if the second judge is a woman. If you are not certain which pronoun judge number two prefers, then "SO BE IT" will also work)

Hope you guys had fun reading this!

#142 Re: Main Forum » To the king who accidentally stabbed me » 2018-04-17 07:43:34

gbear14275 wrote:

To my dear old king,

I realize that you were trying to pass me your knife as part of the transition of king-hood and I don't blame you for accidentally stabbing me after giving me your crown.  Age does odd things to a mind and body and so it's only natural that you might have had a spasm, shake, or otherwise "senior moment".  I just hope you found someone else who was able to take your things before you passed ... and that you didn't stab anyone else on accident.

Your humble servant (and prince for 2 seconds before being murdered),
John

This made me laugh. big_smile

#143 Re: Main Forum » Jason's Murder Problem Thread » 2018-04-16 09:35:27

Lum wrote:

A Karma system is definitely a bad idea. It means every player will have a score that is metagame, that applies to them outside of each life they live in the game. This is a problem because every single life should be unique, with no ties to the last one and nothing coming from these past lives (such as your crimes). We can't have that because it would ruin the idea that each experience is different and unbound from all others tou have had beforehand as well as will have afterwards.

Besides, people would start judging each other based on their karma scores, keeping only certain babies, or creating groups for people with some good scores only

Agree that a general karma system would _not_ be the way to go. However, a player who spends several lives as a player killer is already playing a meta game. It's totally fine for the game if such a player will find himself spawning as a grown male (Cain) in the wilderness next time. He chooses to play meta, and the game will respond by giving him a life long away from the other players next life. After he's lived a full life as Cain, he will spawn regularly the next time. No karma scores.

#144 Re: Main Forum » On grief terrorism, and to new players recently murdered/griefed » 2018-04-16 08:20:16

KucheKlizma wrote:

Just because you don't understand unintended griefing it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

With respect, here is an online definition of griefing (there are other, similar ones):

1. Purposefully shooting or otherwise sabotaging your teammates in an online game.

2. In online gaming where one repeatedly killing the same individual or individuals over and over again, or camping their corpse to prevent them from retrieving it, or otherwise performing actions in a game to prevent the player from enjoying the game.

3. In online gaming, someone who takes pleasure in creating grief for an opponent via various "cheap" tactics.


Unintended griefing does not exist, per definition. If it is not done on purpose, it is not griefing.
You are entitled to your opinions, but please stick to the same definition. If it makes it easier for you, then substitute "griefing" with "intentional griefing" (to the rest of us these are the same, and that's how you need to view and respond to other posts discussing griefing).

Note that doing something bad against other players in game, with the result that you win a benefit for yourself in-game, is not griefing. So stealing food to extend your life is not griefing, while planting wheat with the sole intention to disrupt farming is.

Thanks, and I wish you happy gaming!

#145 Re: Main Forum » Jason's Murder Problem Thread » 2018-04-15 22:43:56

OxPower wrote:

Some of you guys seem to not get the real issue, murder isn't a problem, its the fact that you can destroy a village without ever holding a knife. Also surviving to 60 in the wild is very easy. Not a pissing contest just being honest.

It's not about difficulty. It takes time to live a full life, and in the wilderness you can't murder more people. It's a lifetime sentence, if you will smile

I agree that murder is not a problem, but reincarnating serial killers might be one. In any case, it's the topic of this thread. There are other threads dealing with other topics.

#146 Re: Main Forum » Jason's Murder Problem Thread » 2018-04-15 21:59:47

Zwilnik wrote:

The problem with spawning as an eve is that unless you specifically make them barren, innocent players can be born to them as babies and share their punishment and/or be griiefed by them.

I agree with this. I think that a serial murderer should receive the Mark of Cain and spawn as a Cain in the next life, i.e. a grown male in the wilderness. To remove the mark of Cain, you have to live a whole life until 60 (which is a bit of a challenge in the wilderness, and requires that you sustain yourself buy actually playing the game as intended). If living to 60 proves too difficult, then 120 minutes of gameplay as Cain could also wipe the mark.

You would get the mark of Cain if you kill more than one person within 60 minutes of gameplay. If you kill many, you could receive more than one mark that you would have to wash away by spending several lives as Cain.

#147 Re: News » Update: The Apocalypse » 2018-04-06 08:48:48

This seems like a tricky one. I understand the intent behind it, but the current mechanism could be used by a single player to wipe out what many others may have spent several game hours each to build. What about modifying it thusly:
1. Make the doomsday switch something you can only build and use through active collaboration between several players (like three players have to turn three keys at the same time or something)
2. Make the reset act as a "Prestige" in an incremental game, i.e. make something in the game improved every time the players achieve a reset. (could be things like berry bushes getting one extra berry, a new color you can dye wool with, one piece of higher tech left somewhere in the world, etc etc)
I'm thinking that the doomsday should feel like a collective achievement (and carry some reward). Maybe store info on how many civilizations each player has helped build, too (making it also a personal achievement)
Any thoughts about this approach?

Edit: I also think that the Apocalypse should not carry over between servers. Players should be required to make this achievement happen separately on every server. With the Prestige in effect, this could lead to some nice variations in play between servers.

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