New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

Azrael · 2018-11-10 02:41:18

Hello everyone,

I've had this game for many many months, I'd say I'm one of the last original players when the game initially got popular.

Being as game "wise" as I am, I've experienced many different lives, characters, and stories. One of the most crucial aspects of this game that I've come to understand is the fact that we play together to achieve a common goal, some people think we all have separate goals, but really, we all try to survive and thrive together, the game isn't enjoyable as a hermit or a lone eve.

The game has changed many times since I initially started, "griefing" once was never an issue, because the game was so primal that killing and building cities together, was never a main topic of the game. As more people became knowledgeable and started to create societies that resemble some cities today, griefing become more prominent. People started to complain and Jason uploaded his kinds of "fixes" on it because it was such an issue, whether it was because more advanced societies were constructed or because more people started to play the game, or even if people reached the top of their tech tree and got bored. Jason continued to add "fixes" and introduced the curse system and donkey town.

I have realized that the mentality towards griefers or people that decide to play slightly differently than the majority has changed, it has become more of a faux pas, yet statistically, the amount of murders in-game has stayed the same relatively yet more people report certain acts as griefing?

So I am giving you guys a chance to discuss this, are people becoming more sensitive on the issue? Or have griefers upped their game and more people should be aware of it? How should we approach containing "toxic" players, because as I see it now, people are complaining more than ever about griefers?

Am I such a bad person for trying to enjoy the game in a way I appreciate and interpret? Tell me your thoughts below, thanks guys ^^.

Turnipseed · 2018-11-10 03:24:13

As long as you keep murder to top teir cities i could care less

Monolith_Rans · 2018-11-10 03:35:08

I'm an old player as well. I've lived every kind of life. I've been a nomad wandering aimlessly. I've been a queen of a kingdom. I've been Eve to a thousand newb babies. I've applied my life to menial tasks, and I've lived lives of leisure and role play. I have had every job from road construction, to baker, to Shepard, smith and medic. But I have never ever griefed. Why do people think it's fun to destroy what others have built? Never in my hundreds of lives, did I want to hurt my family or neighbors. To griefers I say, grow up or go play fortnite. OHOL is not the place for you.

Azrael · 2018-11-10 03:53:54

Monolith_Rans wrote:

I'm an old player as well. I've lived every kind of life. I've been a nomad wandering aimlessly. I've been a queen of a kingdom. I've been Eve to a thousand newb babies. I've applied my life to menial tasks, and I've lived lives of leisure and role play. I have had every job from road construction, to baker, to Shepard, smith and medic. But I have never ever griefed. Why do people think it's fun to destroy what others have built? Never in my hundreds of lives, did I want to hurt my family or neighbors. To griefers I say, grow up or go play fortnite. OHOL is not the place for you.

Fair enough I respect your opinion, but that's generalizing just a little, not all griefers are "fortnite players" so I wouldn't say that. One thing people don't understand is that griefing is subjective! If you say you're not griefing but someone else does, it really just depends on your perspective, I for one, do not murder players all the time and break buildings for fun. Griefing is more of an art, some people play differently but really pretending that you've "never griefed" is NOT true because that's just from your eyes. Who knows, maybe dozens of players said you were griefing when you THOUGHT you weren't, nobody here is perfect and believing that you are an "amazing-player-never-griefer" is unrealistic because to someone else, you are a horrible person but to another, you could be the best person.

Anyways, I hope you get what I mean, but I believe that OHOL is a place for everyone and telling someone off like that is immature and really not for a wonderful place like this.

Last edited by Azrael (2018-11-10 03:54:33)

VioletLily · 2018-11-10 04:26:13

I myself loved the donkey town update.

I could take or leave the killing and destruction griefers cause if I'm being honest. I mean, I'd rather them not, but I can handle it if they do.

The real reason I loved this update was because some of the most toxic players left. I'm talking about the people who would roleplay extreme racism or chlid molestation, viciously target and verbally abuse specific people, etc. These people were just plain bullies looking to ruin people's day.

It was so bad when I started playing that I felt the need to post this:
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=3651

I haven't seen anything that bad since the donkey town update. Essentially, this game went from being completely unmoderated to being kind of community moderated. While it's definitely not perfect, it did really help in some ways.

In the end, whether you grief or not is up to you, please just have the common sense and common courtesy to know when you may be taking things too far.

Last edited by VioletLily (2018-11-10 04:27:17)

mikekchar · 2018-11-10 07:38:25

IMHO you can't grief by accident. If you do something that annoys other people by accident, that's not griefing. If you make a mistake and doom your whole town, that's not griefing. Griefing happens when you *intentionally* try to ruin somebody else's game. Killing, even murder, isn't necessarily griefing. Griefing happens when you don't care about whether the other players are having fun. For some people, it's not just that they don't care: they actually intend to make others angry, sad, afraid, etc.

Overall, I really like this game. In fact, my impression is that it has gotten much better over time -- especially with respect to griefing. I disagree that people are complaining more now than ever. I see much less complaints. However, I still have some issues with the way things are set up in the current game.

As I said, I have no problems with murder and intrigue. I have no problems with people plotting to bring down cities, or to throw monkey wrenches in the works. That can be fun. What I have problems with is that there is no way to negotiate consent. If I'm working hard to build up a city, I don't necessarily *want* someone to come in a wreck it. If I'm having a great game and enjoying my time, I don't necessarily *want* someone to murder me and cut my game short.

It's that lack of choice in game style that I think is lacking. I feel Donkey Town was a good idea, but I don't think it's a good idea to make it a complete punishment. I think Donkey Town should be the wild west. People should be able to choose to go there and wreak havoc.

But there is a snag which I can't quite figure out in my own head. If you have a game with wolves and sheep, the sheep do not want to play with the wolves. The wolves also do not want to play with the wolves. This is a problem. It's no fun preying on the unwary if there is nobody who is unwary. It's also no fun to be the one who is slaughtered each time. I don't know how to solve that problem, so I've largely kept my mouth shut. The only solution seems to be to ban the wolves from the game, because there is no way to make it fun for everyone with them in it.

pein · 2018-11-10 08:12:58

well people can be annoying, the most annoying ones don't know why is annoying what they do
they just do it and totally act innocent which makes it even more annoying how can someone lack the basic level of logical thinking or common sense
sometimes it comes from the missing information, you born as a baby, you rush into something and destroy it, you cut down the last wheat, you pick up the seeding carrots, sometimes just the repetitive situation is annoying, someone else did it before you, you told everyone not to do it, like people shearing the last sheep over and over when you got no dung and no soil left
this can make a generally cheap and common item very valuable and the whole situation more intense

the dumbest things i killed someone for was a branch. why? i made a huge wheat field, spent a lot of time with it, we had barely no branches in the forest and i went out pretty far to get one, i understood the first one went to firebrand, tool head, but the second went to kindling, and then comes this little shit, a 4 year old toddler in full gear when i got no gear almost, she picks up my branch and takes it out from my station, i take it back and she takes again and even has some dumb comments, when people are fully geared and too lazy to go out and get their own branch, when they can see someone is clearly using it, is very annoying

i got a temper and i go 1 to 100 pretty fast, but i wouldn't do such a thing to others and pretend nothing happened

when you take someone from others, not knowing that it was just made, like a cart, a tool, even a branch or straw, can be very annoying, it is wasting time, you didn't spent any time assessing the situation and you got selfish reasons, and on top of it you try to prove your right, ignore others or worst is comment back bullshit
so even if the subject of the issue is very small, the circumstances make it much more elevated
generally if there is an old person, means he/she was skilled enough to survive a famine, and it's a good player who had a plan, and still might have, just because you don't value your time, you still should value others time and respect their age
even babies who move around and point on gear remind me the dozens of griefers who did the same as a baby, if i move around and talk shit as baby i totally would understand if someone gets mad at me

donkey town had the upside over black speech cause people were asshole to black speech people, from the main reason that they thought they will never get cursed and assuming that the person did something big, which might be right, but looking only the worst case scenario and not thinking about the whole game in general is bad
i had people provoking me, trying to assassinate me, and acting childish when they failed. you cannot just expect to let myself killed because you think im an easy picking, i played a few games with black speech and if i had 6 bars on a desert i never even talked or i run if they realized i might be cursed and later on wasn't an issue, but i had lifes where i was totally nice, people had seen me working all along, and still i was killed/almost killed just because the speech color. when you got no option to redeem yourself, retaliating is not a choice, it you vs others, the drama making, role playing lazy asses who got a reason to kick in you

made no sense to me why people curse an already cursed person, and why they curse when they are the one who tried to kill you even if you were nice all your life
once i had a cursed girl and abandoned her, cause that's what we did
that city had like 10 people, nobody really working anything, they fixed berry when i got them soil, they cooked eggs when i got them eggs, under my 55 minutes nobody cared about firewood, fire and tools. my daughter born back to someone else as a boy and he had to see the family die out, and killed me cause was dissapointed that he is not a girl and had no chance to keep us alive, and i understood how stupid i was caring for those lazy people over someone who might or might not be an asshole.

i still think people misusing curses
you kill a griefer? they curse you
both of you got weapon and you aim each other?
they just curse the winner of the fight, why they think is their business?
you kill a baby cause its asking for a ban? they curse you
you say ''fuck'' they curse you
they got a friend and you complain they did a mistake? both of them curse you
their mother is a lazy ass who steals stuff and never works? its their mother, they don't work either and try to kill you in 12 minutes because all they seen their mom did nothing and you killed, they missed the argument and the action their parent did and they are too much into the roleplay

the biggest dumb thing i think is still the ones who curse you in front of others and expect that you just will be happy with it
i killed quite a lot of people for cursing me, just so they receive something for their token, i had chain kills of 3 and even made them curse notes after their death and blamed everything on them and acted like they still alive and they do the griefing

and honestly if people cant talk it out, and keep grudge even 30 min later (you pick up a pack from ground and they want it but you don't give, you take a clothing from them as a baby, someone tells that you killed them and they born back to other family) its just pathetic
i had one time in bonsai garden made a teleport and just tossed kids into an enclosed pit room
next life my mom told me that she was one of the victims and all i could say is LOL, cause she was so overly dramatic
start with the fact that she could have jumped out any time, and blamed tree cutting and all stupid stuff on me, when 3 players wouldn't of had the time to do all those things in 60 min
and she came back to curse my previous self, tell others to curse me and repopulate the city (with more gingers i guess)
and when she realized i might be the same person, tried to drop me on a bear, she starved when i jumped out a few times, and i went back and kileld off most city just for the sake of it
now i get it that what i did is not proper playing, babies starving didn't lose anything, a bit of time, but this mass cursing over 2 hours cause you are too sensitive, its kinda dumb
the whole point would be to curse people who destroy a city, cut out trees, steal stuff, not for pity personal feelings
other day my mother abandoned me, i poked a bear to get killed faster she pick me up and curse me
jokes on you i spawned as eve and cursed her back

i even see curses as a sign of weakness, if you are cursing you admit the other person can get under your skin
you don't like him? kill it, surely some others will stick up for you if you are right
i don't understand how someone get offended when you curse him back or don't let him kill you, or why wont think you kill him for cursing you
i was cursed once with a note in the most populated city and honestly i didn't really mind that i was in donkey town
yeah i was more careful and sneaky to take down people, walk out the range of sounds, tell people i gonna kill someone for something
frame someone i don't like and then kill, provoke someone to say stuff in front of others and then curse in mass
but honestly this isn't the wa i want to play it
it would be better without killings, maybe, killings are to stop a griefer, an ignorant player who does harm based on misinformation
yet a lot of people just think all kills are bad and should be punished with no question
most people think knives are a family treasure and deny from others to use as a tool

if you want to kill people and spend all your life on it, you can kill people who doesn't expect it, and if they try to work and defend against, you are in advantage

same goes for people who curse, i seen tons of framers, people who jump to conclusions too fast, people with big family and bad attitude when you criticize them
if i try to work and someone disturbs and loves for the drama, i got disadvantage, she doesn't care if everyone starves, as long as can 'retaliate'for calling her wasteful, goes around ,eats, talks with people, makes up shit about you
we reached the top of tech tree, people in big cities got nothing to do, if they got a knife someone will start killing, chain kills mass cursing, all those bullshit will happen in a short time. i was in casino city holding the key for the knife chest, i distributed 3 times the knives and all 3 times ended up in mass murdering all around.

you might think is better, but being a grey bird wont get you cursed, being the leader of a city and try to advance the civilization always puts you in middle of drama, people will try to manipulate you and get your attention somehow, i don't have the time to chitchat to everyone, im happy if i can talk a bit to the 4-5 kids i raise up, the whole curse tokens are dumb when they got no real cost.
i still stay in relative good curse score as i play a lot and dodge big cities with lot of rp nabs if i can, or i go to a corner and only talk with a select few

if there is interaction, it will be drama, if i start bullshit, i totally wouldn't be surprised if i get cursed for it, yet lots of people are so selfish and tryhard to enforce their opinion on others even if they were the one who was wrong

now i wasn't griefing cities like ''wherever i will be born i will destroy it''
if i get pissed and its an unoptimal camp with assholes in it, men killers, cultist rpers or monarchists, i might get pissed and i mess their dumb camp up for retaliation
if i get killed for no reason but i still spawn back in other family i might get revenge, its not fun to kill anyone and i kinda even suck at self defending when i wasn't wrong, when im pissed you better run away cause in 2 minutes i find a way to take you down

Dodge · 2018-11-10 08:41:37

There's good "griefers" and bad "griefers", if for example you call out your mom for abandonning you, talk to her in front of the villagers where everyone is (usually berry field),get mad at her and threaten her in front of everyone, then decide to take revenge on her and make an arrow with a note explaining why, then that's the kind off griefing that's interesting and creates a story

But if you randomly kill the last girl of an eve camp then that sucks, at least act really weird and suspicious before you kill her so it gives them a clue that you are up to something and give them the oppurtunity to react to the situation

Hiding tools, cutting all the wheat on purpose, killing all the sheeps etc, that's not good griefing that's just being an annoying asshole

A good griefer creates entertainement, by interacting with other villagers, it breaks the routine of doing the usual tasks, a bad griefer is just someone annoying and creates no entertainment besides the satisfaction of killing/cursing him

@Azrael what kind off grief to you usually do?

Vexenie · 2018-11-10 10:49:17

Monolith_Rans wrote:

I'm an old player as well. I've lived every kind of life. I've been a nomad wandering aimlessly. I've been a queen of a kingdom. I've been Eve to a thousand newb babies. I've applied my life to menial tasks, and I've lived lives of leisure and role play. I have had every job from road construction, to baker, to Shepard, smith and medic. But I have never ever griefed. Why do people think it's fun to destroy what others have built? Never in my hundreds of lives, did I want to hurt my family or neighbors. To griefers I say, grow up or go play fortnite. OHOL is not the place for you.

The last part makes it look like, that most griefers are either childish adults or little trolly 6-10 year olds

VioletLily · 2018-11-10 11:57:08

Vexenie wrote:

Monolith_Rans wrote:
I'm an old player as well. I've lived every kind of life. I've been a nomad wandering aimlessly. I've been a queen of a kingdom. I've been Eve to a thousand newb babies. I've applied my life to menial tasks, and I've lived lives of leisure and role play. I have had every job from road construction, to baker, to Shepard, smith and medic. But I have never ever griefed. Why do people think it's fun to destroy what others have built? Never in my hundreds of lives, did I want to hurt my family or neighbors. To griefers I say, grow up or go play fortnite. OHOL is not the place for you.
The last part makes it look like, that most griefers are either childish adults or little trolly 6-10 year olds

This is mainly because many of the traits griefers potray are the same traits most commonly attributed to children/immaturity.

Children and adults possess different traits for good reason.

It is believed that throughout history children who were selfish, attention seeking, etc were more likely to survive.

Adults, on the other hand, were more likely to survive when more community minded. This made traits like empathy, responsibility, gratitude, and selflessness much more important at this stage of life.

These set of traits conflict making it near impossible to have both. So over time we evolved to have both set of traits at the seperate, appropriate times of one's life.

The actions of griefers simply potray a set of traits more commonly associated with childhood, causing them to come across as immature.

A person people would generally consider mature would simply be much less likely to grief.

Last edited by VioletLily (2018-11-10 12:03:33)

MultiLife · 2018-11-10 13:48:29

Yep. I see griefers as immature due to the selfish angle of their actions.
Griefer:
"Purposefully shooting or otherwise sabotaging your teammates in an online game."
They put their enjoyment over others, because they do not care if their fun ruins someone else's fun. To me, it's selfish, it's immature.

In this game we are a team. Players are supposed to fight against environment, PvE. It has slight PvP to it, but OHOL is not a PvP game, imo.
We are supposed to build civilization, not destroy it. This would be a very different game if it was about PvP and destroying civilization.

I'm bothered by these odd ways Azrael is phrasing his words;
"New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!" ...known, like it's a popularity thing?
"So I am giving you guys a chance to discuss this" ...uhhh thanks?
"Am I such a bad person for trying to enjoy the game in a way I appreciate and interpret?" ...victim card or something, wat? Bad people=selfish, don't care about others. Mm-hm.
But anyways not gonna go deep with this.

Answers to the topic questions:
- no, there is not more whining about griefers in my view, but people use the word for wrong things often
- Donkey Town is good and can be whatever as long as we as a community can banish people so we get a break to build things - I think bad sport lobbies are good things to give the players environments fitting their playstyles

Last edited by MultiLife (2018-11-10 15:11:02)

tana · 2018-11-10 15:03:44

To me a griefer is someone that plays with the unique intention to systematically or occasionally destroy/kill the villages they are born into. And I must say that since the donkey town implementation, I really haven't seen those types of players anymore wich i'm really glad of.
So I'm not a griefer, but I have been called one and cursed/killed for :
- killing all the sheared sheep
- destroying a kiln that was in the way (even though I had build a new first)
- taking a knife that was considered an heirloom
- taking down an old unpractical pen after building a new better one
- digging up superfluous berry bushes
- and more other little stuff, but don't remember them all

I also know that some players consider those that are roleplaying and those not contributing but building presonal projects as greifers.

Last edited by tana (2018-11-10 15:09:15)

happynova · 2018-11-10 19:25:55

"It's so sad. People spend all their time making nice things, and other people come along and break them." -- The Doctor

Anyway. I agree with things that other people have said, especially that you can't be a griefer by accident, that the very definition of a griefer is that you are deliberately doing things that ruin other people's fun. If your goal is to destroy things that other people are trying to create, to upset or anger people, to create an environment that other people don't want to play in, or to randomly kill people for your own pleasure (thus denying them the chance to keep playing in a life they may be enjoying and invested in), then you are a griefer. You are also an asshole, and I have no time or sympathy for you. I am no more interested in your fun than you clearly are in mine, and if I have any control over the situation at all, I will do what I can to make sure you don't get to play with the rest of us.

But mistakes made out of ignorance are not griefing. Differences of opinion, even heated ones, on things like how many berries to plant or who gets to use that maple branch are not griefing. Killing people is not always griefing, if there is an actual reason for it. Over-enthusiastic roleplaying, even if it ends in bloodshed, is not necessarily griefing, although there can be a bit of a fuzzy line there, depending on what you're role-playing (seriously, if you enjoy going around pretending to molest babies, get some help) and to what extent you're trying to force other people to play a game they're not interested in or find distasteful.

As for the reason griefers are often referred to as childish or immature. Well, really, someone who wanders around OHOL stabbing fertile women and cutting down all the wheat and slaughtering all the sheep is the exact equivalent of the kindergarten kid who goes around kicking over other kids' blocks. That kid either just thinks it's fun to wreck things and doesn't think about or doesn't care about the fact that some other kid spent time on that block tower and was enjoying what he was doing with it, or he has such a craving for attention and any kind of reaction he can get that he actively enjoys the other kid's upset response. Either way, you hope and expect that little kids will grow out of that sort of thing, but some of them never do. They just stay that way: childish and immature, treating the world as if it's made out of other people's blocks just there to be kicked.

And in this game, that behavior seems even sadder and more immature to me, because there are plenty of other games in which everyone is happy to agree that the fun is in kicking over each other's metaphorical blocks. But this isn't one of them. If you enjoy fighting and breaking things in a game -- and, in the right context, those are completely legit things to find fun! -- there are plenty of games that are for that, where PvP is part of the whole point. But if you think it's more fun instead to harass people who just want to have fun collaboratively farming some virtual carrots... That's so pathetic I almost feel sorry for it. I'm still not putting up with it, though.

Anyway, as I said in the thread where Jason was musing about changing away from Donkey Town, you don't need griefers -- real griefers, the kind who are actively trying to make other people miserable -- for drama and conflict. Someone ruining your fun, by definition, is not fun. But all kinds of interesting conflicts and drama can and do arise organically as people play the game. People argue over resources or strategies, they fight over crowns, they develop attachments and rivalries, they get into misunderstandings. It very much seems to me that since the advent of Donkey Town, there's less full-out actual griefing, the kind that is annoying and tedious and a whole lot of no fun. And now that people are spending less time on the annoying and tedious and un-fun work of dealing with griefers, there's a lot more time for those actually interesting kinds of drama and conflict.

Azrael · 2018-11-11 02:16:01

MultiLife wrote:

Yep. I see griefers as immature due to the selfish angle of their actions.
Griefer:
"Purposefully shooting or otherwise sabotaging your teammates in an online game."
They put their enjoyment over others, because they do not care if their fun ruins someone else's fun. To me, it's selfish, it's immature.
In this game we are a team. Players are supposed to fight against environment, PvE. It has slight PvP to it, but OHOL is not a PvP game, imo.
We are supposed to build civilization, not destroy it. This would be a very different game if it was about PvP and destroying civilization.
I'm bothered by these odd ways Azrael is phrasing his words;
"New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!" ...known, like it's a popularity thing?
"So I am giving you guys a chance to discuss this" ...uhhh thanks?
"Am I such a bad person for trying to enjoy the game in a way I appreciate and interpret?" ...victim card or something, wat? Bad people=selfish, don't care about others. Mm-hm.
But anyways not gonna go deep with this.
Answers to the topic questions:
- no, there is not more whining about griefers in my view, but people use the word for wrong things often
- Donkey Town is good and can be whatever as long as we as a community can banish people so we get a break to build things - I think bad sport lobbies are good things to give the players environments fitting their playstyles

I think you don't understand why I made this post. It was to get people's opinion, honest opinion on griefers, on people who according to many, are not needed in the game and are only people who "intentionally ruin other peoples fun". While I agree many people are very toxic and annoying, this doesn't change the fact that so many accidental or unintentional actions are considered griefing.

Many people have said that "accidental actions and people being ignorant is not griefing" while that IS true the players of this game can interpret that differently. One life I was killed for shearing a sheep, while I made those shears and sheared it to be productive, it was considered griefing because it was "the last sheep". Many instances of this occur, I know many people who are now killing noob players just because they "grief" their things even if it's unintentional. Where do YOU draw the line? As I said, everything is subjective. you don't have to be a child to be a griefer because according to many griefing is something that "ruins" other peoples fun, and they do it intentionally, what if you do something intentionally to stop another player or to build the society that someone else disagrees with? Or if you ruin someone's fun, but their fun was doing something that you thought was unproductive, are you then considered a griefer? It's such a subjective term in-game, but people like to place an objective definition as if "drama" is not grieving, or is "good griefing" but, taking a branch from someone intentionally IS griefing.

Overall, we can all conclude that let's say ruining a town by killing everyone IS griefing, but is that realistic? If you're not in donkey town by doing that, how is there still drama? Drama is very much based on what you do to other people, it could be grievfng or it could be accidental but many people like to group everyone in one giant clump, and then they judge them profusely, what if you are a griefer in one life intentionally but in another you're a very successful eve? I've experienced many times, how someone who knows your title as a "griefer" won't play with you but in-game you could be playing with each other and having fun without even knowing who they were. Honestly, it's all a bunch of baloney, people DO treat griefers like celebrities because they trash talk them, and try to expose them, and try to do anything to rid them from the community, but then they play with them fine in-game.

Perspective matters, no one knows what goes on in someone else's head, if you do something that other's consider wrong, but you don't acknowledge that, and then start pointing fingers at someone else, when will the cycle end?

bENdI · 2018-11-11 03:04:03

hello fellow griefer. i do enjoy griefing time to time but people do not care because they have the tools

To the "good" people:
Honestly, the thing that makes post-steel eras in this game fun is drama generated from griefing. Yeah, it sucks when you get killed and the "Treat others the way you want to be treated" mentality is nice, but don't get so worked up about griefing. Literally everything in this game is temporary, and I see people whining about griefers. The game attempts to reflect reality, and reality has bad people and if you can't accept that then don't play. I'm not saying I condone griefing, but I'm not saying I don't. Crime should be manageable, it's just that people in-game aren't organized enough and that's not their fault. I just need you to calm down and think of griefing as a minor inconvenience. Yes, it causes problems, but what do those problems do in the long run? Yeah, it "ruins" the game, but does it really? You can just get reborn and it's not like you were working on anything super important, but if you were, then what a shame. Just. Move. On.

as they say "there can't be love without hate"

startafight · 2018-11-11 05:17:37

the only kind of griefing that honestly bothers me off are senseless ones. if theres some drama behind it like "that dude killed my dad!!" its all fun and games (ive even got a few posts up here about how i helped a few murderers for the rp). but if someone just decides to destroy an entire city for no reason other than "its just how i like to play" theres no fun in that. or if its an eve camp that barely has anything anyways but the people are doing their best to work together.

ive always been down for fun murder that can be fought back against, but when its impossible thats when things get frustrating.

think of it like this: usually camping is looked down on in fps games. same for just bullying noobs that dont know how to fight back. its the same concept - when people start repeatedly picking on others that cant fight back its not fun, its annoying.

it makes the game less enjoyable for people who are working on things b/c they've probably put in 30~40 minutes of their day (a significant chunk for those with lives) into whatever they were doing for it all to be broken down by some asshole in 2 minutes.

bENdI · 2018-11-11 05:20:23

startafight wrote:

but if someone just decides to destroy an entire city for no reason other than "its just how i like to play" theres no fun in that.

i agree.
i only grief when the settlement is stable, because there should never be stable settlements ever. also, i dont straight up kill everyone because it's not really fun to see the fruits of your labor if nobody is gonna carry on

pein · 2018-11-11 07:13:49

this is where you are wrong, ignorance is griefing
we value time differently, we can work all life, we can talk all life, i do rp sometimes and just eat what others produce (generally when i spent a life making food), but i don't hoard resources to myself, and i don't act like i run shit, i don't mess with others work or take stuff from them, or if i do by accident i say sorry, even if it calls me names, if its my fault i try to make up or at least stop doing it
now if i take it seriously, i got a time schedule, what i want to do, when, if you mess it up, and you keep ignoring me and delaying me, undoing my work it creates frustration

we are not equal, its just an illusion, if you want to enforce others to do something, have the tools for it, prove you are worthy or prove you are more skilled, and killings are just for that, if you know Mirelli, probably was your mom a lot of times and she is very good at parenting, but before she dint really know how to kill others, was a liability as a city leader, now she is one of best players you can wish to protect you

if you do a mistake, you need to accept consequences, you should react and ensure it wont happen again or you had a reason to do it
if you ignore a player making mistakes, you are part of the problem, some of us can work and still see what others do and try to interact spending our time to help, if you ignore it, its just as much a problem as you do it by will, as you prove that you arent able to compromise
yeah, might be a second chance, a third, but if you still not react people telling you to stop, you are worst than the one who destroys stuff to gain attention
if you prove that you are a selfish person, demanding clothes and then you don't help others, it annoys everyone who is naked and tries to work. they don't need to say it, and you don't need to be said, you should know it. nothing is for free and you are not special.

sometimes i jump into conclusions fast and kill innocent people, but if they act as a griefer its better safe than sorry
i had many hours, many people who got a second chance, and i can say most of them will cause problems later on, if i miss the chance to kill them early than i will regret it, so if you did a mistake, it's a minimum to listen to the person trying to help and warn you and ensure you had a reason, or say sorry, or ask why does that matters, if you ignore advises you wont learn.

MultiLife · 2018-11-11 12:11:09

Azrael wrote:

I think you don't understand why I made this post. It was to get people's opinion, honest opinion on griefers, on people who according to many, are not needed in the game and are only people who "intentionally ruin other peoples fun". While I agree many people are very toxic and annoying, this doesn't change the fact that so many accidental or unintentional actions are considered griefing.

Why didn't you just say that in the title then? "What is a griefer in your opinion and why we don't want them" or something along these lines? Very easy to get the point if you phrase it like that.

MultiLife wrote:

Griefer:
"Purposefully shooting or otherwise sabotaging your teammates in an online game."
They put their enjoyment over others, because they do not care if their fun ruins someone else's fun.

Quoting my post; that's what a griefer is no matter what people want to believe it means. Some people use the term however they please but it doesn't change the fact that this is what a griefer is.

Azrael wrote:

Many people have said that "accidental actions and people being ignorant is not griefing" while that IS true the players of this game can interpret that differently. One life I was killed for shearing a sheep, while I made those shears and sheared it to be productive, it was considered griefing because it was "the last sheep". Many instances of this occur, I know many people who are now killing noob players just because they "grief" their things even if it's unintentional. Where do YOU draw the line? As I said, everything is subjective. you don't have to be a child to be a griefer because according to many griefing is something that "ruins" other peoples fun, and they do it intentionally, what if you do something intentionally to stop another player or to build the society that someone else disagrees with? Or if you ruin someone's fun, but their fun was doing something that you thought was unproductive, are you then considered a griefer? It's such a subjective term in-game, but people like to place an objective definition as if "drama" is not grieving, or is "good griefing" but, taking a branch from someone intentionally IS griefing.

We have had a thread like that here in forums and from that I learned that people use it for many different cases; wrong accusations oftentimes. And there is no accidental griefing in my books. That's just "making mistakes", not griefing. If I call you a griefer, you have sabotaged me and my team with malicious intent, just to sabotage us. Take away malicious intent and it's just you making a mistake that hinders me and my team. Or you having different opinions in farming or such. There is enough room for you to build your society and for me to build mine.
People are great at accusing others and bad at reality checks, people should read what "griefer" means before throwing the term around. And yes, people have misconceptions over each other, sometimes someone truly seems like a griefer while they may have been new. It happens.
I have been killed with false accusations: was smithing a hoe for my milkweed/carrot farm, someone broke a kiln, a lady ran in, screaming it was me, that "I had a shovel" (I had a hoe, but I dunno how to break kilns), then few years later she walks up to me as I gather stuff at the edges of the town and stabs me, still blaming me over a broken kiln. To her, I was a griefer, but if she had done some shadowing, she would've learnt otherwise. Mistakes are made. Nobody was a griefer in this case, unless the lady blaming me had malicious intent to frame me. I had no hard feelings, I was just disappointed and hoped she wasn't at least framing me, but making an honest misconception over me.

Azrael wrote:

Overall, we can all conclude that let's say ruining a town by killing everyone IS griefing, but is that realistic? If you're not in donkey town by doing that, how is there still drama? Drama is very much based on what you do to other people, it could be grievfng or it could be accidental but many people like to group everyone in one giant clump, and then they judge them profusely, what if you are a griefer in one life intentionally but in another you're a very successful eve? I've experienced many times, how someone who knows your title as a "griefer" won't play with you but in-game you could be playing with each other and having fun without even knowing who they were. Honestly, it's all a bunch of baloney, people DO treat griefers like celebrities because they trash talk them, and try to expose them, and try to do anything to rid them from the community, but then they play with them fine in-game.
Perspective matters, no one knows what goes on in someone else's head, if you do something that other's consider wrong, but you don't acknowledge that, and then start pointing fingers at someone else, when will the cycle end?

The cycle will never end. People will always make hasty judgements over each other. And people will always throw around terms like griefer or troll without checking what that truly means. People will always experience things differently which may cause them to accuse others falsely.
We must expose griefers to each other in-game to avoid getting killed ourselves. We must be shadowing suspicious players and talk about them so when we deliver a shot or stab, people know what's going on. I think outside of the game the griefers are eager to expose themselves to us, making posts about it. But to me that's not a celebrity thing that we talk about them to each other, that's just making each other aware and learning the tricks so we can cut down their damage.
Sure, some people make a great effort to go their way to trash talk to a griefer, but hey, they probably have experienced something really nasty because of a griefer, so to them it feels like someone getting a taste of their own medicine. My gen 8 line was killed off by a griefer (not a big city nor a long family tree, so why do such?), who talked about it in his last words, rubbing it in; that's simply nasty, and it pleases me to hear how they suffer in Donkey Town. They should try suffering too, it sucks, maybe they could learn some empathy? But yeah I am a human after all, not a saint.
Drama, I still dislike that. But I can say that the best drama is making a team effort against dangers (I dislike other players acting as dangers, a "meh" from me to that) while rollercoastering through ups and downs on the way. Bad drama is the whole "child rape/molestation" talk while you spew racist slurs and hide bowls while people stab and shoot at each other in confusion. Effff that. Bad drama is when people are sucked into it and suffer because of it, good drama is when people come together to survive through it and enjoy the challenges.

Overall, there is no sympathy towards griefers from me, but there is sympathy towards falsely accused players.
There is no accidental griefing.
There is a lot of misconceptions and bad communication.
There are a lot of hasty people who judge others in a rash manner.
There is a lot of misuse of the terms such as "griefer".
There is good drama and bad drama.
There are people who are out to ruin others' game with malicious intent.
There are people who seem like they are ruining others' game with malicious intent when they weren't.
People won't change, we will always have a cycle of misunderstanding.

Last edited by MultiLife (2018-11-11 14:15:09)

Joseph Stalin · 2018-11-11 13:49:56

those are some long posts lol

Lum · 2018-11-12 06:53:53

Do you feel emotions?

Luka · 2018-11-12 07:40:11

Oh yeah, I'm an og player too

Elsayal · 2018-11-12 09:00:24

Short post :

I like griefer, they make the game more intersting.

If only "happy cool builder yay" exist, life would be boring.

PeaGirl · 2018-11-12 14:23:38

There was some youtube video about the experience of death. In there I think there was an interesting perspective given, which would pretty much explain to this how people behave like this to griefers in general.

"Boy named Death and girl named Life play by the seesaw. They never stop playing, because if they did, all existence stops. Death, which we often fear and try to survive from is lonely, whileas Life who is taken for granted, and is never listened towards."

While others see griefers as something we want to get rid of, for what I have think so far, is the salt and perhaps the only thing that makes the game taste like anything. Griefers presence gives me at least a purpose to fight, and die for it if necessary. Death is not all bad, when it would eject new life. The town we so hard tried to build dies out, only for a new eve to find it eventually. Personally if there was no one willing to even griefe at all, the game would be nothing but continuous walkthrough over tens of hundreds of times of same tech tree over and over, while there is not yet much to explore. I think if there is Life, there should be some Death alongside to make this game more enjoyable, although I sometimes disagree with it and get upset when shit goes down but... they do have a purpose. We just get upset over it too much and don't enjoy the game we had enjoyed in general BEFORE.

kawkaw · 2020-01-14 04:18:37

I'm new to this game. in today's game, I got born as a girl in a town where half of our people got killed. when I had my second baby a lady visited our town and told me that she is from far away and her brother used to live in my town. her family needs resources and asked for our permission if her family can stay in our town. My mom approved her request. Her whole family shifted to our town, a lot more people than we thought it would be. At the same time, I've had twin babies. being new to the game it was so hard for me to tc of the two babies. My mom warned me that our town has only few girls left, so I did my best to keep twins (girl & boy) alive. Suddenly I saw my children running around calling me. The new family shifted to our town started to mass-murdering us. The last thing I saw was my kids running and asking for my help. The Man killed me while saying "LOL" and i was not ready to fight(I don't even know if I can fight back in this game). I just hope that any of my kids survived. Seriously wtf is wrong with some of these players?

One Hour One Life Forums

#1 2018-11-10 02:41:18

New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#2 2018-11-10 03:24:13

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#3 2018-11-10 03:35:08

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#4 2018-11-10 03:53:54

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#5 2018-11-10 04:26:13

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#6 2018-11-10 07:38:25

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#7 2018-11-10 08:12:58

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#8 2018-11-10 08:41:37

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#9 2018-11-10 10:49:17

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#10 2018-11-10 11:57:08

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#11 2018-11-10 13:48:29

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#12 2018-11-10 15:03:44

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#13 2018-11-10 19:25:55

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#14 2018-11-11 02:16:01

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#15 2018-11-11 03:04:03

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#16 2018-11-11 05:17:37

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#17 2018-11-11 05:20:23

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#18 2018-11-11 07:13:49

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#19 2018-11-11 12:11:09

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#20 2018-11-11 13:49:56

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#21 2018-11-12 06:53:53

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#22 2018-11-12 07:40:11

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#23 2018-11-12 09:00:24

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#24 2018-11-12 14:23:38

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

#25 2020-01-14 04:18:37

Re: New Oppurtunity, Talk to a Known Griefer!

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