Lower the Donkey Town Requirement

Booklat1 · 2019-02-12 20:53:40

Well you want me to prove something I've never stated. And why do we care if griefers go into stabbings? that is a pathetic form of griefing which anyone should be able to defend from, either killing back girl killers or talking to other townsfolk. Most people killing others end up dead, there are infinitely better forms to grief like hiding important tools, killing sheep. If anything going into a spree will give you a short lived thrill often interrupted by random bakers.

Cursing should be a decent way to stop griefers but i hardly see the need of Jason spending at entire week at it as the game currently is. And I'm not sure lowering lowering the threshold for curses is the right change the mechanic needs. Sure, curses should hit recurring griefers harder but how do you do that withhout also occasionaly hitting players fighting back? You know, killing fixes a problem much faster.

Another thing is that the same way some people would rather curse because killing is hard I'd much rather kill a griefer when they're starting to cause havok. I don't think its fun when they spend a couple minutes just to grow and get killed in their first griefs.

CrazyEddie · 2019-02-12 21:17:33

Jason implemented killing because he thought that would be a good way to deal with griefers, and because it seemed like a make-the-game-more-like-the-real-world move. "In the real world, you stop people from doing bad things by using cops, who ultimately derive their coercive powers using lethal weapons. So I'll give you the ability to do that, too!"

Unfortunately, Jason was wrong. His approach was naive. Griefers don't participate in the in-game construction of social infrastructure, and creating an in-game model of the real-world social infrastructure doesn't affect their behavior.

Griefers don't care if you kill them; they expect it. Griefers care if you take their toys away. That's what curses and Donkey Town are for.

CatX · 2019-02-13 00:47:41

What if Donkey Town was treated as a feature?

Some people obviously enjoy griefing. And some enjoy the added drama of having griefers around.

What if, in addition to the possibility to be exiled to Donkey Town, you could also choose to be born there from the log-in screen?
There would be more people there, and all would participate with the intention of pvp combat. It would be the place to go for people who enjoy the suspense of hunting others and being hunted.

It could even be tweaked to serve those players better. Bananas could regrow. Domestic berry bushes could function like the ones in the wild and regrow berries, at least for a few cycles. Finding food could be made so easy that the main focus would be on tracking other players and killing them. There would be less need for tedious farming and more time for excitement.

A separate family tree could display the characters with most kills, all time and this week.

While the 'real' OHOL world could similarly tweaked to discourage griefing. For example, knives and arrows could break if used to hurt someone. Or they might require more than one wound to kill someone.

DestinyCall · 2019-02-13 01:03:17

CatX wrote:

What if Donkey Town was treated as a feature?
Some people obviously enjoy griefing. And some enjoy the added drama of having griefers around.
What if, in addition to the possibility to be exiled to Donkey Town, you could also choose to be born there from the log-in screen?
There would be more people there, and all would participate with the intention of pvp combat. It would be the place to go for people who enjoy the suspense of hunting others and being hunted.
It could even be tweaked to serve those players better. Bananas could regrow. Domestic berry bushes could function like the ones in the wild and regrow berries, at least for a few cycles. Finding food could be made so easy that the main focus would be on tracking other players and killing them. There would be less need for tedious farming and more time for excitement.
A separate family tree could display the characters with most kills, all time and this week.
While the 'real' OHOL world could similarly tweaked to discourage griefing. For example, knives and arrows could break if used to hurt someone. Or they might require more than one wound to kill someone.

PvP Town would appeal to some griefers ... but there would still be ones that want to grief in the "real" OHOL specifically because they know people won't like it. If killing is expected and their potential victims are armed and aware, then it is a fair fight. But, if griefers want a fair fight, there are many battle royale games to choose from with better combat systems. In a regular village, people are trying to live and work. Murder and griefing is a disruption. It breaks the rules and ruins other people's fun.

Griefing is not about killing, really. It is about watching someone else's world burn and laughing at their tears. That's why serial griefers plague our villages. Because we care about them and put time and effort into making them, like children building a really tall tower out of wooden blocks. And then the griefer walks over and knocks it down ... just because he can.

LucidFugue · 2019-02-13 01:41:51

I don't think adding a bunch of features to make the Donkey Town a better place is a good solution. It would incentivise griefing. The idea is that you are not dealing with other players in the game in good faith, as judged by those players. Therefore you are cleaved from the player base.

We don't just have cops in real life, and people don't follow their directions just because they have guns. We have a justice system. Punishment scales with offence. If every crime results in death, there is no scale. Banishment to donkey town goes beyond death. It should be the worst outcome unless you want to ban accounts.

The curse system acts as a peer review, but most players have incomplete information about the scenario and relying on witnesses to the event introduces problems around bias.

A good justice system relies on good information and an impartial arbiter for accurate, fair decision making. That can still be other players, but the systems we have for evidence to transcend a given incident are incomplete.

The murder debuff is a solid example of the right way forward, I think. It brings witnesses together and provides time for explanations and judgement.

The more pernicious forms of griefing don't have that dynamic.

pein · 2019-02-13 10:07:46

well, my cities working
if you got 100 people on server, maybe 10 is veterans, 20 is decent, 60 doesnt even know what is doing

in a city, maybe you got 1-2 people doing stuff
now if you dont care for doing anything, you wont get mad? well thats not the case, people are angry for not letting them steal your resources
like you see the city has no milkweed, you plant some, someone thinks, oh we got enough i just take the ropes
actually its quite annoying when people cut corners, now you might not see it, cause you to occupied not to starve, you might not care, you just care about yourself

some people think they are nice because they raise babies and give clothes to them and they talk to others, and they try to make stuff, and they water berries
on a higher level all those things are irrelevant
i can calculate that we got 10 people so i do X amount of pies, but then we actually need 2x cause no one even pays attention not to overeat
no one ever gets firewood, no one ever prepares the pies or maybe makes an oven and makes 3 pies under 30 minutes

i get it, not everyone is pro, not everyone can see what is the need of the city
but then why are people so selfish, why dont they care about future? why they prefer their own kids? why do they still think they deserve the highest tech clothing, the only cart, the only horse?
will come a kid and will ask that where is the pen? where is the tools?
and you standing with 30 babies on a perfect spot and say "oh i had no time"

i get that people play this game differently but in the end, the few decent players will feed everyone else, while newbies come back over and over, and starve at age 5-6 then again , then again, and nothing gets done.
I rarely see a decent camp, where people got a plan, a setup, tools and sheep pen.
Why does it matter? i will go old, get to other camp, and i can start to do it again from scratch. If someone else comes to my camp, he can actually focus on higher tech, upgraded carts, cars and engine wells.
So it comes down to FOV, communication, skills. its not easy to ignore sometimes how useless others are. When you get cursed for making compost or saying something who actively wasting stuff you worked for, and still thinks he is right and you are wrong.

If i would be so pityful as most people, i would need 10 curses per life, if i would make a video each time someone does actively something stupid and others could vote on it, would you think it would be better?
Do you think that everyone is equal? Do you think that over 1000 hours i cannot tell that what skill level are you on? cause i seen people from steam with 90 hours and thought the world is his and everyone owes her clothes for her existence. And maybe it works with other people, can enforce them to submission, maybe even a crown on your head works, or being older/being their mother, but when they meet a competent player, they cannot do anything, and they start cursing, framing and telling people lies to get their way.

So yes, i often make the most important advancements in city, and often meet the other people who try to do the same, or quite the opposite, the ones who think that they deserve to take all resources for their own projects and fuck me for not letting them.
Not everyone plays this game for talking and eating, and messing around, i cant just chit chat in an eve camp and pray to banana god to give us food, i exactly know how and when everybody will starve.
So instead of finding scapegoats and cursing people cause they are "rude" for telling the truth, why dont people actually try to improve the situation by themself?
In which universe its logical to call someone a griefer and then you go and eat the food produced by him?

just because you dont know you are doing harm, and you dont like how others act, doesnt mean you are right.
Your opinion wont change the facts. Did someone ruin your experience? what is the actual reason? isnt that you ruin theirs? who controls you when you are selfish? no one. so newbees are quite bad at deciding who is the actual fault. i see a girl standing near berry field, thanking the old uncle for saving her, thats nice and all, but then she was the firse to curse when i killed a griefer. is she in a position to decide who needs to be punished? i dont really think she had a clue what the other player did, or why is that a bad experience for others.

i do think that some people dont deserve to have curse points until they learn the game mechanics
and this trend of cursing and killing geared players and males is pretty much the case
newbees gang upon others to gain their resources, they demand feeding them, they demand clothes, they demand that none of them gets punished, they rely on others when its upon producing soil, getting water, etc.
do we need them? no not really, as long is not the last female, do the player produces as much as he uses?
usually not
but we can tolerate them, and give them distraction, and maybe they learn something, and next time when they got alone o na camp, they can reproduce working setups
all this comes with the expectation that they actually learn and try to contribute
this is all on reverse, people who cannot produce enough food decide on how many babies we raise, people who doesnt work, got more time to go around, beg for clothes, give clothes, chit chat and ask others to curse
what you can do? make working cities and leave it to lazy role players, and start again cause you will get cursed if you got any problem with the oens who ruin everything

i often feel like im the only one who cares, like keeping up a fire for 60 minutes and fixing berries over and over, picking out the carrot fieds 2-3 x per life, making all the compost. then i ask something and the answer "fuck you do it yourself" cause they are busy making paper and cutting goose heads and building rooms. this is not ok and people shouldnt think they run the city when they arent actually. i seen games where a chick tried to kill me cause she wanted to be the "leader" i was saved and no one gave a fuck that i kill her
but often times you work for 50 minutes and kill a 8 year old griefer and everybody gangs upon you
reverse case, when i move an item cause its not optimal, a person who worked 5 minutes with it, makes its life mission to kill me

now if i say that higher game play amount gives more experience, and better decision, i think thats generally right, so what if those higher hours would be an actual advantage ? i guess everyone would just moan. when you got the possibility to play more and have the same advantage.

cursing on sight and not get killed for it? dude, you already say that you dont like a person, and dont like the decisions. what should i do? piss myself? let you kill me? leonard, that whole point of view makes no sense.
lets say that someone wants to kill me, i defend myself. you see a bloody knife and curse me then you go and stuff your head with the pies i made. even talk back that im a griefer/killer and such. Next comes the girl of the noob assasin and tries to take revenge. What should i do? let it? like if i was right in first place than shouldnt people apologize? and if im wrong, still its a personal matter, where people choose to solve by a fight. a third person has nothing to do with that. You dont like killings? you dont like fights? its still wont change the fact that those people have a reason to fight and they arent trying to kill the lineage or not randomly killing. Maybe, just maybe you worry that the person will kill others, then kill him on cooldown. Cursing him only pissing he off. Just because someone has more experience in killing, doesnt mean he was the fault. generally who has more experience in killing, has more experience in everything else. Basically by cursing or shit talking you deny the possibility of him being right, deny the possibility of getting back to society, and because your paranoid behavior you might kill him on cooldown which is a cowardly act. I dont question that they had a reason to curse, i question that they got the skill and enough information or proof to curse me. And generally i work a lot and produce a lot, and i share the excess, and i dont mess around with other people stuff, so its the minimum they dont do with mine.

So no, i dont see how cursing is first, you punish killing by killing, especially if you dont know the reason and circumstances. You only curse a person who is alive, when he destroys stuff and runs away, ignoring communication. it still means you need to kill him eventually. It doesnt work like i dont like him so he needs to go to jail. In real life false testimonies result on you being punished. So if you curse someone falsely, you just gave a pretty good reason to be killed. No i dont have time to curse someone back, it does nothing, i know that others wont curse him cause they dont care and i keep curses for people who actually grief and ruin things. Stop using curses for personal opinions and enforcing others into submission.
Yes, knifes are being used more often by the players who can make a knife, store a knife, know to use a knife, and yes, ruining things by accident, and ignoring communication is kinda the same as if you do it by intent. So yes, the majority of people who get killed, deserve it.
The times when a knife is inherited or left open either by death, giving it to babies based on relation, results in killings with no reason more often.

That could only be fixed by a way of 'decaying' knifes, where a kill destroys a knife(can be remade) or a knife only lasts for 60 minutes or by locking knife to one player and that player can give permission to others to use it. What i see generally is that people hog onto clothes, knifes, file, and dont let others to use one, but they dont give others one when they clearly a highly skilled person. So you end up making one for yourself and each life some gets lost, soem gets inherited by unskilled persons and tons of iron gets used up for it.

Any time i ask people why i got cursed, they tend to run around getting more people to curse me, or they try to kill me, or they say a lot of stupid stuff without any proof. If i let it go they might calm down for a while but more often than not they end up very offensive and they try to piss you off even more or kill you. and quite annoying that they dont realize that you work 50 minutes for the city but the moment you kill a griefer they cry about their poor daughter who didnt kill people for 7 years, its their daughter and they raised her well standing near her 3 minutes not telling anything.

CrazyEddie · 2019-02-13 18:55:20

one day you'll get tired of your own whining

One Hour One Life Forums

#51 2019-02-12 20:53:40

Re: Lower the Donkey Town Requirement

#52 2019-02-12 21:17:33

Re: Lower the Donkey Town Requirement

#53 2019-02-13 00:47:41

Re: Lower the Donkey Town Requirement

#54 2019-02-13 01:03:17

Re: Lower the Donkey Town Requirement

#55 2019-02-13 01:41:51

Re: Lower the Donkey Town Requirement

#56 2019-02-13 10:07:46

Re: Lower the Donkey Town Requirement

#57 2019-02-13 18:55:20

Re: Lower the Donkey Town Requirement

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