An end to /die

Jov · 2023-11-17 06:29:57

Having the same player spawn in and die in your arms repeatedly is an awful experience. They will often allow you to greet them, stop what you are doing, and begin walking over to the nursery before typing it.

I understand Jason doesn't want suggestions, but I think I have a good idea that's fairly simple:

1) Allow players to return to the family they were with last, if they have recently died and if they haven't been exiled. This could also cost additional lives.

I think that alone might be enough, but these additional changes could work too:

2) Reduce the amount of lives from 45, and/or reduce the regen rate.
3) To prevent this from making survival too easy, you could disallow rejoining the same family until the next generation has reached maturity. Perhaps the players could even "queue up" as an unfertilized egg in a random female. This could actually be a cool experience, if there is special music and sound effects!
4) Manual respawning could also be restricted to families who have built a requisite item, like a crib that can only be the property of one person. Or a female having consumed a special 'fertility meal'.

Discuss!

Last edited by Jov (2023-11-17 06:32:32)

SoloAceMouse · 2023-11-17 06:48:23

Family selector would be so much better than endless /die spam, in my opinion, but Jason's attitude seems to be that picking your family goes against the spirit of the game.

As a result, we're stuck with the alternative of a billion baby bones, lol.

fug · 2023-11-17 14:15:52

Easy solution to reduce /die

Just make it always cycle and not be completely random. This would reduce one person landing on the same mom repeatedly unless they were blocked.

So this does 1). Makes family selection easier as if there’s four families three /die commands puts you in each family once.

2). Gives you an idea if you are blocked or fertiles not in an area (you will skip a family it blocked or fertile is too young/not in town.

3). Reduces unintentional/die spam because after the first cycle it is random what family you go to.

4). Allows better family selection while still keeping random lives intact.

In fact, I’m just gonna make a GitHub with this exact suggestion.

squishysquid · 2023-11-17 20:15:27

but then you'd have to live with how weird "I'm queue'd in your womb" sounds.

fizzbuzz · 2023-11-17 22:17:08

I've only been playing for about a month but I agree that /die is problem, for reasons Jov explained pretty well already, it really is an awful experience. From my perspective the /die command could just be removed outright with no adverse impact, and as far as the number of lives allowed, 2 (_maybe_ 3) per hour would be plenty. But, I understand that other people want to play the game differently and I respect that, nor do I believe one way of playing is more correct than any other regardless of the creators intentions.

I've got no idea what solution(s) might be effective, but I did want to echo that I agree a problem is there.

fug · 2023-11-17 23:04:00

But there would be an adverse impact: People would still kill themselves but instead it's running babies (This happened in the past) which now punishes you for your kid not wanting to play in your town.

Life tokens are so high because when the game has a high new player population boom they die and they die a lot. There have been times where people literally bought ohol and life tokens stopped them from being able to play. If you've never played when new players are around you'll see how much important it is for the game to be lenient AND how important it is for people who know how to be play be in places to help.

No one knows when a big population boom is going to happen and Jason isn't always avaliable to just suddenly flip the server settings to make the game more playable.

Laggy · 2023-11-18 12:36:05

Problem isn't /die, its people that abuse it to be annoying.

Simple solution is to make /die impossible after like 10 seconds.

I got good news... Most modern mice come with 4 buttons. Therefor Jason could make one of those buttons = /die

Problem solved.

Jov · 2023-11-23 17:07:21

"Before, only a player's last SIDS-death mother would be remembered and
avoided. If the player did /DIE repeatedly, this last SIDS mother would be
replaced, allowing them to revisit the same mother repeatedly over time,
which was annoying. Now we maintin a full list of every mother for which a
given baby player has done /DIE, and we avoid those mothers as long as they
remain alive. If the baby player runs out of mothers, they go to Donkeytown.
This will reduce the occurrence of SIDS generally, since players that are
doing this will skip mothers that they want to avoid after only one visit.
But also, it forces baby players to have some skin in the game. If they SIDS
too much, they will run out of mothers and go to Donkeytown (temporarily,
until more mothers become available) instead of cycling through mothers
forever and annoying people. Fixes #983"

https://github.com/jasonrohrer/OneLife/ … 1fdaaaa177

Awesome! Thanks, Jason! Looking forward to this.

TheSamWish · 2023-11-23 17:41:07

Already sent to donkey town after one /die on server 9 trying to get back to my eve spawn. Thanks I hate it.

Jov · 2023-11-23 18:18:05

TheSamWish wrote:

Already sent to donkey town after one /die on server 9 trying to get back to my eve spawn. Thanks I hate it.

"If the baby player runs out of mothers, they go to Donkeytown."

Sounds like you had no other option. If there was an unmature female you were waiting on, you could kill yourself at Donkeytown or wait longer before trying to come back to avoid this. So it still sounds like a net improvement to me, unless I'm missing something?

Last edited by Jov (2023-11-23 18:18:42)

TheSamWish · 2023-11-23 19:07:40

Jov wrote:

So it still sounds like a net improvement to me, unless I'm missing something?

On low population servers (basically every server besides bs2) people eve chain. You can not get back to your base while there is anyone else online now. You are forced to play with them or suffer in DT. And I'm still not sure if going to DT as an Eve resets your Eve chain bit if it is the case then my town is lost forever.

TheSamWish · 2023-11-23 19:13:34

It does reset your eve chain FYI to anyone else playing on other servers

Strilar · 2023-11-23 22:26:09

I've been debating this very topic a few times already in the past HERE and HERE

So I, for one, am happy with the recent change in the new update! Hopefully it will be the end of people abusing this mechanic. We'll see how it goes.

Laggy · 2023-11-24 14:35:24

I still think Jason is still missing the point.

Why are you giving people 2 minutes to /die?

If I name you, dress you, for 2 minutes and you /die I will curse you.

That is a long time to type four characters.

Yet people seem to be doing this. Every game!

Last edited by Laggy (2023-11-24 14:35:40)

Strilar · 2023-11-24 15:28:17

Laggy wrote:

I still think Jason is still missing the point.
Why are you giving people 2 minutes to /die?
If I name you, dress you, for 2 minutes and you /die I will curse you.
That is a long time to type four characters.
Yet people seem to be doing this. Every game!

As a person who dislikes the /die command, I actually understand this... it's not just about choosing if you want to be born male/female or black/brown/white/ginger... the /die command is the right for a player to say "I don't want to play in this family/village" so they don't just go running off and killing themselves or having to restart the game to live a life they may enjoy.

This may take 2 minutes for a player to reach that decision, maybe the mother was out of town and they wanted to check if it was a small eve village or big developed town, or maybe the player decides to /die because he sees drama happening around or people griefing and he doesn't want to live with that, maybe the player wants to see if the mom or players around are "nice" in order to decide if he/she will stick around or not.

So as much as I always sad when a baby dies in my arms since I like to care for my family, I can't force the player to play with me or to live where I'm living, thus it doesn't bother me that much if it only happens one or maybe twice in a lifetime, but when the number of SID babies gets excessive that's when it is starting to be an annoyance, specially if it's just that ONE player trying to choose the exact conditions of their birth and coming back to my arms over and over until they get it right, the new update intends to help deal with that.

TL;DR:
Personally I understand why a player should have 1-2 minutes to look around and decide if they want to /die or not. What I still don't understand is why SID bones take 2 minutes to decay and just get in the way, for all intents and purposes they were never born, so what purpose does that 2m decay time serve? :-)

Laggy · 2023-11-24 15:46:28

Strilar wrote:

Laggy wrote:
I still think Jason is still missing the point.
Why are you giving people 2 minutes to /die?
If I name you, dress you, for 2 minutes and you /die I will curse you.
That is a long time to type four characters.
Yet people seem to be doing this. Every game!
As a person who dislikes the /die command, I actually understand this... it's not just about choosing if you want to be born male/female or black/brown/white/ginger... the /die command is the right for a player to say "I don't want to play in this family/village" so they don't just go running off and killing themselves or having to restart the game to live a life they may enjoy.
This may take 2 minutes for a player to reach that decision, maybe the mother was out of town and they wanted to check if it was a small eve village or big developed town, or maybe the player decides to /die because he sees drama happening around or people griefing and he doesn't want to live with that, maybe the player wants to see if the mom or players around are "nice" in order to decide if he/she will stick around or not.
So as much as I always sad when a baby dies in my arms since I like to care for my family, I can't force the player to play with me or to live where I'm living, thus it doesn't bother me that much if it only happens one or maybe twice in a lifetime, but when the number of SID babies gets excessive that's when it is starting to be an annoyance, specially if it's just that ONE player trying to choose the exact conditions of their birth and coming back to my arms over and over until they get it right, the new update intends to help deal with that.
TL;DR:
Personally I understand why a player should have 1-2 minutes to look around and decide if they want to /die or not. What I still don't understand is why SID bones take 2 minutes to decay and just get in the way, for all intents and purposes they were never born, so what purpose does that 2m decay time serve? :-)

This seems a little selfish. Is the mothers time meaningless?

Strilar · 2023-11-24 16:13:45

Laggy wrote:

This seems a little selfish. Is the mothers time meaningless?

I agree, it's a little selfish, but that's what the /die command has always been about, so a player can decide if they want to live there or not or go do things the way they want to do so. The /die command never took into consideration the feelings and desires of the player who controls the mother, it's all about the feelings and desires of the baby

Sadly the alternative was that if you could only /die in the first 10 seconds or something like that, if I didn't wanted to play in a town I see want to play because it's being griefed, what option would I have? I would have to run away from the mother and try to starve or kill myself in the wilds, and the mother would probably waste even more time trying to chase to try to catch and save the baby.

This is why although i dislike /die and never would kill myself even without it, I understand and accept why it exists.

Laggy · 2023-11-24 16:25:47

Another unintended consequence of the 2 minutes /die would be....

Your family has 2 fertile females, and they are both like 36, and a baby gets born as a female then waits 2 minutes to /die then does it again to the other female.

Since your locked from having another kid while the first is still a kid, someone could easily kill off families with a couple lifes like this.

That's how you kill off a family.

Last edited by Laggy (2023-11-24 16:28:22)

CatX · 2023-11-24 16:36:32

The opposite might be true as well, the person who considers leaving might want to make sure that there are enough fertiles before they /die. Having those two minutes might help them make an informed choice. If there is little time to choose, they might leave before they know they're needed. I've seen it happen, fams dying because the last three babies left even before someone could ask them to stay.

Laggy · 2023-11-24 16:53:35

CatX wrote:

The opposite might be true as well, the person who considers leaving might want to make sure that there are enough fertiles before they /die. Having those two minutes might help them make an informed choice. If there is little time to choose, they might leave before they know they're needed. I've seen it happen, fams dying because the last three babies left even before someone could ask them to stay.

Yeah people /die after 2 minutes to be nice....

Keep telling yourself that.

TheSamWish · 2023-11-24 17:20:37

Laggy wrote:

Yeah people /die after 2 minutes to be nice....
Keep telling yourself that.

The vast majority of people who /die are not doing it to be malicious to their mother.
Most players who /die are just trying to get back to the town they were part of in a previous life. New players use /die for this purpose the most. A lot of veteran players will /die as a male because you cannot have babies. Some players /die just to tank their gene score so they don't get leadership. There are so many reasons for a baby to /die. Abusing it just to annoy people is not a common way I see it being used.

SoloAceMouse · 2023-11-24 18:03:23

TheSamWish wrote:

The vast majority of people who /die are not doing it to be malicious to their mother.
Most players who /die are just trying to get back to the town they were part of in a previous life.

Yeah, I see people complain about SIDS bones a lot and speculate that the person doing is trying to be annoying.

This is usually a good indicator that the person is not terribly experienced in OHOL.
Most veteran players I have spoken to have told of times where they had to /die 20+ in a row to get the spawn they were going for.
Pretty much every community regular who isn't a purist choosing not to use /die has had this experience.

There are numerous cases of using /die many times in a non-malicious manner, but I think some less-experienced players are unfamiliar with this so they assume malice.

CatX · 2023-11-24 19:07:42

Laggy wrote:

Yeah people /die after 2 minutes to be nice....
Keep telling yourself that.

It doesn't bother me if they don't. As a fertile female my main focus is usually on raising kids anyway, not on whatever project I happened to be doing when the kid was born. Did I tend the fire during those two minutes? Yay, I was useful. If the kid in the end didn't want to stay in town with me, that's their loss.

SoloAceMouse · 2023-11-24 19:25:41

CatX wrote:

It doesn't bother me if they don't. As a fertile female my main focus is usually on raising kids anyway, not on whatever project I happened to be doing when the kid was born. Did I tend the fire during those two minutes? Yay, I was useful. If the kid in the end didn't want to stay in town with me, that's their loss.

To be honest, I don't understand why people get so upset about /die babies.

If I'm working on something and I have a baby, I just give it my clothes and keep working. If the baby feels uncomfortable about not being in the nursery for some reason they /die, otherwise I just carry on and feed them as needed.

If they die at 2 seconds or 2 minutes, I don't care either way.

Maybe they started a life and but their dog threw up so they /die at 2 minutes because they have to clean it up. I don't understand why people assume it's malicious when it has no substantial cost to them, anyways.

fug · 2023-11-25 02:52:43

The annoying part was for mom and baby getting the same spot repeatedly. Baby doesn't want to be somewhere, mom doesn't want the baby leaving.

Mom doesn't want the annoying bones, baby just straight want the race/gender they got. Gender is an issue because someone who cares about family length doesn't want to be a boy, someone who cares about play doesn't want race.

I would rather spend 4x+ my life tokens for a specific gender, and race would be worth more to me. Though this leads to people wanting to just pick the combo which Jason is against. Boys are just not good unless getting oil or some odd case where not having kids is good lol.

Raise how many a fertiles a family needs to have boys and boom you fix the issue with *wanting* to play girls.

One Hour One Life Forums

#1 2023-11-17 06:29:57

An end to /die

#2 2023-11-17 06:48:23

Re: An end to /die

#3 2023-11-17 14:15:52

Re: An end to /die

#4 2023-11-17 20:15:27

Re: An end to /die

#5 2023-11-17 22:17:08

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#8 2023-11-23 17:07:21

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#9 2023-11-23 17:41:07

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#10 2023-11-23 18:18:05

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#11 2023-11-23 19:07:40

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#12 2023-11-23 19:13:34

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#13 2023-11-23 22:26:09

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#14 2023-11-24 14:35:24

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#16 2023-11-24 15:46:28

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