For those who say you can no longer leave a legacy

Kinrany · 2018-04-27 19:10:28

Its his opinion that the game is failing.

That's not the important part, scam accusations are way worse than accusations of incompetence.

jasonrohrer · 2018-04-27 19:16:11

Xuhybrid wrote:

I am glad to hear that it hasn't been a complete loss at least. Hopefully over the course of the games life, it will garner more popularity. I have definitely had my doubts and i think that's at the core of most complaints. Everyone has doubts, even you i'm sure.

I definitely have doubts. More than doubts. I have certainty.

I know the game is not as good as it can be. It was boring 8 weeks ago, and it is getting less boring, but it's a hard design problem to solve.

People "stopped playing" many weeks ago, which is why I'm working myself to death trying to improve it.

Being born in a mega-village that already has everything is boring, because what you do doesn't matter. There are no wrong choices, there is no tension, there is no dramatic arc. Do what you want... who cares?

Check out this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-WylITUECR4

As I watched that.... my certainty grew and grew. That's definitely not the game that I ever wanted to make.

The fact that my game was like that several weeks ago was an accident on my part.

I'm not knocking the creator of 2HOL. It's great to see mods that explore all the different options. And I also get that many people like a game with no challenge where you just do whatever you want. Minecraft creative mode is hugely popular, obviously. But I never played creative mode....

OHOL will never be a game where civilization and progress is easy, assuming that I can solve these design problems.

Your legacy will be hard-won.

sliderule · 2018-04-27 19:38:45

I love your vision of the game and support all of the changes you've been making, Jason. Great job!

powa · 2018-04-27 20:03:24

Stop persecuting the man.

He only referred to everyone directly as customers to counter the ridiculous and hateful post that he was replying to. We are customers, that's not false. But in contexts where he's not being harassed, he doesn't point that out.

Treating someone like they have no right to object to such bullshit simply because they are a developer shows how little experience you have in a position of authority. Of course it's not a good strategy to fight fire with fire at that level of disrespect. If you would like to remind someone of this fact, do it without stooping even further. But acting like a developer has no right to defend his name, that's a peculiar kind of ignorance.

We should be supporting and congratulating the developer for his hard work and great game. If you disagree with the direction he's taking it, you can state your opinions where appropriate and succinctly.

Just like for anyone else, there's no excuse for verbally bashing him or continuously bringing up the same critiques that he has consistently addressed over and over again.

The perseverance to continue working overtime on this after all the crap thrown his way is admirable. One should be ashamed for making snarky and disrespectful posts and stop nitpicking his minor mistakes.

Edit: "prosecuting" works okay, but "persecuting" is better.

Last edited by powa (2018-04-27 20:27:09)

Uncle Gus · 2018-04-27 20:20:07

I'm sorry you have to deal with this kind of shit, Jason. I have no idea how you stay so calm and patient with morons like this. I'm not the dev here, so I can say what I want about these people.

"Y'all are fucking dicks."

Drakulon · 2018-04-27 20:24:02

powa wrote:

Stop prosecuting the man.
....

Yes! This is exactly what i want to see, people defending Jason instead of him defending himself.

Uncle Gus · 2018-04-27 20:30:18

Well, when there's only one person on one side, being personally attacked on multiple sides for having the shear audacity to create a game for you to play, he kind of needs some support against the fucking dicks, wouldn't you say?

Turnipseed · 2018-04-27 20:46:27

Hey if thats how everyone feels i retract my statements.
Im just to sensitive i guess

Drakulon · 2018-04-27 20:56:24

Turnipseed you did nothing wrong, you just expressed your feelings (in a friendly way).
I am the evil guy here

Last edited by Drakulon (2018-04-27 21:14:58)

jasonrohrer · 2018-04-27 21:28:24

I have no problem with people arguing about the direction of the game.

My problem is with people questioning my motives.

I'm not making the changes that I'm making out of laziness or greed or for fraudulent reasons.

The changes that I've been making are WAY more difficult than just piling new content on top of a broken game would be. I could have been putting out 100-objects-per-week updates for the past 8 weeks, and we'd have 1500 things in the game. But we'd have a laggy server, one giant mega city in the center of the map, instant murder with no evidence left behind, crashes post-update when people forget to disable custom server, etc.

Instead, I've been making all of these less-visible changes that often involve a lot of programming and refactoring and thinking. For example, I'm currently rethinking the way that object decay and tool use is implemented, and this has involved a few days of programming.

In the midst of all this programming work, I've still been getting some kind of content update out every week.

But I imagine that it will be a few more weeks of this kind of necessary programming work before the 100-objects-a-week updates become a regular thing. I'm getting pretty close to that point, as the list of programming tasks gets shorter and shorter.

Along with programming, I've also been tweaking the existing content, which is what everyone is all upset about. But that part has to be GOOD. 800+ objects.... that part is a full game in and of itself already. How many unique objects are in Minecraft?

FeignedSanity · 2018-04-27 22:18:06

Hey Jason, I just want to say thank you for the game and for everything you do. I was one of the players experiencing the boredom of spawning into cities that already had everything (or being a stones throw away from one that was). I feel like there is so much negativity and people complaining about almost every recent decision you've made to make the game more "artificially difficult or tedious" that I would voice my opinion to the contrary. The updates have made the game much more enjoyable for me, they just take some fine tuning on development end and adjustment on player end. Thanks again and I personally don't care how you respond to people hypothetically slandering your name/reputation or committing libel, although I understand people's arguments for "taking the high road" (side note: I haven't seen anything could conceivable be seen as going to far by any person's standards, but maybe I just haven't seen it).

Xuhybrid · 2018-04-27 22:24:26

You keep making comparisons to Minecraft, and while i know exactly why that is, i can't help but disagree. Notch is a terrible game designer. He had an interesting coding project, an idea that he just wanted to work on. He wasn't making a game for people to play, he was excited by a coding challenge that interested him. The fact that the Yogscast blew the game into such a huge cult hit, was very lucky. That's not to discredit Notch at all. Without him it wouldn't have existed, but what you and him are doing (in OHOL) are very different i feel. He was just programming something based on a game he liked. I do this kind of thing too. It's usually too rough of an idea to be called a full game though. That's why he stepped back and eventually handed it over to his team Mojang and then Microsoft. Those developers fixed all the glaring issues and added so much content above and beyond anything Notch could imagine.

To summarise, what you're doing is equal parts Notch and equal parts Mojang. You obviously have equal interest in both the programming and the game design aspects.

Last edited by Xuhybrid (2018-04-27 22:25:48)

Potjeh · 2018-04-27 22:31:12

Minecraft objects are more feature rich, though. You can do all sorts of thing with redstone and there's no equivalent in OHOL (though hopefully we'll have copper wiring one day).

KucheKlizma · 2018-04-27 22:35:36

Xuhybrid wrote:

That's why he stepped back and eventually handed it over to his team Mojang and then Microsoft. Those developers fixed all the glaring issues and added so much content above and beyond anything Notch could imagine.

Correction:
That's why he stepped back and eventually handed it over to his team Mojang. Those developers fixed all the glaring issues and added so much content above and beyond anything Notch could imagine. ...and then Microsoft....

You also fail to mention there was nothing quite like Minecraft at the time, it was a niche, nowadays the market is full of Minecraft clones.

P.S. Having a pioneering concept and being able to implement it in a functional condition isn't something to trivialize.

Last edited by KucheKlizma (2018-04-27 22:40:36)

Xuhybrid · 2018-04-27 22:39:35

KucheKlizma wrote:

Xuhybrid wrote:
That's why he stepped back and eventually handed it over to his team Mojang and then Microsoft. Those developers fixed all the glaring issues and added so much content above and beyond anything Notch could imagine.
Correction:
That's why he stepped back and eventually handed it over to his team Mojang. Those developers fixed all the glaring issues and added so much content above and beyond anything Notch could imagine. ...and then Microsoft....
You also fail to mention there was nothing quite like Minecraft at the time, it was a niche, nowadays the market is full of Minecraft clones.

Sure, i formed the sentence a little poorly. I didn't mean to imply that Microsoft has done anything good for the game. I also didn't feel it important to state the obvious as it didn't really relate to my point, but that is certainly a good comparison to OHOL. There is nothing like this available.

Go! Bwah! · 2018-04-27 23:47:09

Potjeh wrote:

Minecraft objects are more feature rich, though. You can do all sorts of thing with redstone and there's no equivalent in OHOL (though hopefully we'll have copper wiring one day).

I would love for this game to have a dash of Nethack thrown in. Time permitting, and all.

Uncle Gus · 2018-04-28 00:26:41

Sorry for losing my cool. This is exactly why I say that I don't know how Jason stays so calm. I'm not sorry for defending him, however.

Zombeh · 2018-04-28 03:14:57

I'm not going to say I'm fond of all of the updates lately, but I know the game is still new and being built every day. It's not going to be 'perfect' in a single day, nor will it ever be perfect to everyone. You can't please everyone. That's just how it is. I don't have much to say that hasn't been said by others honestly.

I jut wanted to say thank you. I appreciate the time and dedication you put into the game though. You've put out a lot of updates and coding changes weekly and I do see you pop into the Discord once in awhile to communicate. You even reply on the forums too. That's way more then a lot of other game designers and teams do. Things may not be ideal for everyone right now, but it'll get better. I have faith in you.

Last edited by Zombeh (2018-04-28 03:15:50)

jasonrohrer · 2018-04-28 03:28:11

Notch is a terrible game designer?

He made the most successful video game in history.

It wasn't just Yogscast. It was everyone who played it and had their mind blown, including me. Have you browsed the original Tigsource thread?

https://forums.tigsource.com/index.php?topic=6273

Okay, maybe he "ripped off" Infiniminer, but where was was that game headed?

And so many games game were inspired by Minecraft that it's almost silly. Rust. Don't Starve. Terraria. Factorio. And even my own games The Castle Doctrine and One Hour One Life. Notch created a genre.

Minecraft is certainly the Doom of our generation.

Drakulon · 2018-04-28 05:16:54

Xuhybrid wrote:

Notch is a terrible game designer. He had an interesting coding project, an idea that he just wanted to work on. He wasn't making a game for people to play, he was excited by a coding challenge that interested him.

I think this is also a reason why he was so successful, if you make a game you want to play yourself, it will be way more fun and you will be more creative. I think its impossible to program a game you dont like and be successful with that.

Xuhybrid wrote:

That's why he stepped back and eventually handed it over to his team Mojang and then Microsoft. Those developers fixed all the glaring issues and added so much content above and beyond anything Notch could imagine.

I played minecraft since the alpha, i cant remember any updates i liked since notch left. I dont care about cats in the jungle or new crappy textures. But what was really cool were all the custom modes people made, like factions/mcmmo/tekkit.

Last edited by Drakulon (2018-04-28 05:18:45)

Potjeh · 2018-04-28 10:16:40

Nah, Minecraft was a Dwarf Fortress ripoff initially. Now that's an influential game if there ever was one, but it can never be big because it's UI is incomprehensible.

One Hour One Life Forums

#26 2018-04-27 19:10:28

Re: For those who say you can no longer leave a legacy

#27 2018-04-27 19:16:11

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#28 2018-04-27 19:38:45

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#29 2018-04-27 20:03:24

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#30 2018-04-27 20:20:07

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#35 2018-04-27 21:28:24

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#36 2018-04-27 22:18:06

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#39 2018-04-27 22:35:36

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#40 2018-04-27 22:39:35

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#41 2018-04-27 23:47:09

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#42 2018-04-28 00:26:41

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#43 2018-04-28 03:14:57

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#44 2018-04-28 03:28:11

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#45 2018-04-28 05:16:54

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#46 2018-04-28 10:16:40

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