Awful Players - The Curse System is NOT Working

Trick · 2018-08-17 09:17:16

http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … &id=882523

Alice was the epitome of awful players. She griefed in every way imaginable.

Cut up all the furs into 4 pieces. Placed as many seeds as she could all over the place. Force fed people to get rid of all the food. Aggro'd bears. And of course, murdered all the females.

Completely decimated the entire lineage.

The cursing system is not a good enough incentive for people to not act like shit in the game.

It should be 5 curses = 1 hour where you can *only* spawn as an Eve. Currently, cursed players are being born as babies in larger towns, and idiot players are letting them stick around (some even go as far as protecting the cursed child). It actually almost incentivizes getting cursed because they become the center of attention everywhere they go, and too frequently, people are willing to "give them a chance".

Again, the cursing system doesn't actually work. It doesn't actually punish bad behavior, so it doesn't prevent bad behaviour.

It *NEEDS* to be fixed.

Matbat · 2018-08-17 10:44:38

Broken idea here, maybe we can attack cursed players with things not normally a weapon?
Cursed player takes all knives? too bad, hit in the back with an adze.
Cursed baby and elder doesn't want to knife it? smash it with a straight branch.
It'll definitely moderate cursed players actions when they can only kill with a few items but everyone else can kill them with anything if they slip up in the slightest.

marsrider · 2018-08-17 11:26:15

I agree, there is literally no penalty for cursed ppl at all. There has to be some severe consequences made by Jason, not just my us.

MultiLife · 2018-08-17 11:39:08

Yes. I've been passive about the anti-grief systems as I've wanted to gather more experience and ideas before criticizing anything. I agree that the curse system is way too weak. And the black speech bubble is the beacon for attention some crave and want to have so they threaten and kill until they get it, as usually someone will raise them anyways. Having something special, even infamous, makes people desire it. Attention, uniqueness, reactions...

I like the "forced to Eve life" idea, or anything that renders griefers immobile or limits them. I have thought about a banishing system so enough curses and you are teleported to the wilderness (even if you are sitting inside a locked room). The demands for curses should be less for sure.

Matbat wrote:

Cursed baby and elder doesn't want to knife it? smash it with a straight branch.

Oh my god, so brutal, and I still laughed out loud at that. But honestly I like the idea that you can kill cursed players with other tools, maybe even rocks, BUT, that may push the griefers to hide and trash stuff even more, most likely... Well it still sounds better than not having it.

TL;DR: curse system is truly too weak, I like "forced to Eve life" idea. I also like "attack with tools if cursed" idea. Anything that makes griefers weaker than others is good.

Last edited by MultiLife (2018-08-17 11:52:02)

subria · 2018-08-17 13:31:16

I like this game except curse system. But we talk too much about it. So if Jason ask again, we will discuss. If not, you can not change anything.

jasonrohrer · 2018-08-17 15:08:59

You guys are saying that there's simply no way to handle this problem yourselves, and you need me to handle it for you automatically.

In real life, there is no curse system, and no justice is automatic.

Justice is one of the most interesting aspects of civilization. It's a hard problem to solve. It may be THE main problem that civilization faces.

And here you are, facing it. It's tough! People are hard to catch. The innocent get hurt, and the perp often gets away. Some people feel bad for the perp and give them additional chances, etc.

Sounds like a really interesting problem to me. One that I don't want to solve for you.

The curse system is there to make up for the one small difference from real life: reincarnation.

If you have people in your village who are raising cursed babies, and you think that is wrong, what are you going to do about it? Argue with the parent? Kill or curse the parent? Start a committee to inspect every newborn baby in the village? Then a mother notices her cursed baby and rushes into the hills to hide it from the committee?

Interesting....

bENdI · 2018-08-17 15:22:45

This game pretty much attempts to imitate real life as best it can, so why not have bad people every once in a while?

Look, you can't eliminate criminals, and every time you try they come back. So to that I say, deal with it! Why else would you think the world has Justice Systems? Maybe in this game you can start creating some sort of way to combat the griefers when the cursing does not. Stop trying to flock to Jason to get all of your problems solved. Give the man a break, let him work on the game rather than fixing social problems that can be resolved by the players themselves if they would just organize a little bit.

btw Jason, if u really want to stop the griefers, go ahead, i just think that people rely on you too much

Anigamer · 2018-08-17 15:25:37

jasonrohrer wrote:

You guys are saying that there's simply no way to handle this problem yourselves, and you need me to handle it for you automatically.
In real life, there is no curse system, and no justice is automatic.
Justice is one of the most interesting aspects of civilization. It's a hard problem to solve. It may be THE main problem that civilization faces.
And here you are, facing it. It's tough! People are hard to catch. The innocent get hurt, and the perp often gets away. Some people feel bad for the perp and give them additional chances, etc.

Sounds like a really interesting problem to me. One that I don't want to solve for you.
The curse system is there to make up for the one small difference from real life: reincarnation.

If you have people in your village who are raising cursed babies, and you think that is wrong, what are you going to do about it? Argue with the parent? Kill or curse the parent? Start a committee to inspect every newborn baby in the village? Then a mother notices her cursed baby and rushes into the hills to hide it from the committee?
Interesting....

Honestly a good point
Well done Jason

willfrank84 · 2018-08-17 15:28:14

Jason, given that lineages are never longer than 24 hours and most lineages die off due to griefing there is an issue with griefers being unable to be controlled/contained by society. Sure it adds drama and intrigue and I get the allure of that....but in society the criminal element could under NO circumstances kill off all fertile females in the entire civilization. Wrongdoers could be caught or killed because they were a tiny percentage of said society. You want towns to handle crime then there needs to be additional measures in place to allow them to do so. A person slowed after a murder could be hit with tools to murder them. A global chat for the town could better spread word and organize a resistance to an attack by griefers. A lasso could be used to temporary hold down a suspect for 5 minutes for questioning if a town suspected bad behavior. Those injured by knives or bows could have bleedout timers extended by 30 seconds giving more probability of them being healed by an advanced town. Again, a global chat in an advanced town would allow someone hurt outside town to name accuser and ask for help as they ran to the center of town giving the town time to gather the medical supplies.

Joriom · 2018-08-17 15:31:34

Curse system is not perfect. Nor is real life. Deal with it.

Curse was not mean to be solution. It was meant to be a tool to counterbalance the fact that you can get reborn right away and start griefing in other place which is not possible IRL. If you're raising kids that a large group of people decided to curse - thats your own fault. Control your population better. Idiots raise them? Teach idiots better or... get rid of idiots with a knife.

Anigamer · 2018-08-17 15:37:07

willfrank84 wrote:

Jason, given that lineages are never longer than 24 hours and most lineages die off due to griefing there is an issue with griefers being unable to be controlled/contained by society. Sure it adds drama and intrigue and I get the allure of that....but in society the criminal element could under NO circumstances kill off all fertile females in the entire civilization. Wrongdoers could be caught or killed because they were a tiny percentage of said society. You want towns to handle crime then there needs to be additional measures in place to allow them to do so. A person slowed after a murder could be hit with tools to murder them. A global chat for the town could better spread word and organize a resistance to an attack by griefers. A lasso could be used to temporary hold down a suspect for 5 minutes for questioning if a town suspected bad behavior. Those injured by knives or bows could have bleedout timers extended by 30 seconds giving more probability of them being healed by an advanced town. Again, a global chat in an advanced town would allow someone hurt outside town to name accuser and ask for help as they ran to the center of town giving the town time to gather the medical supplies.

Ahem stop bitching nothing is perfect, society is far from it, murderers go without punishment in real life, honestly just make two knives one given to a trustworthy person and one for hunting. That’s my solution if you can’t just accept the fact that shit happens

willfrank84 · 2018-08-17 15:50:46

I don't care if murders get punished or not. Certainly in society a murderer can die of old age. My issue is that a single murderer can kill off a civilization in the current version of the game.

If you wanted the game to be like real life you could have players randomly die of disease before reaching old age. But clearly that would be a stupid game mechanic.

Joriom, if its completely feasible for a smart civilization to prevent griefing, why hasn't a single civ lasted more than 24 hours lately? The answer is simple. The game isn't designed for there to be. Call me crazy but I think a game where you could sometimes be reborn into a town 18 hours after you were last in said town would be greatly rewarding

And anigamer, stop your bitching about my bitching. I'm adding constructive criticism.

LaughAtlantis · 2018-08-17 15:52:51

willfrank84 wrote:

Jason, given that lineages are never longer than 24 hours and most lineages die off due to griefing there is an issue with griefers being unable to be controlled/contained by society. Sure it adds drama and intrigue and I get the allure of that....but in society the criminal element could under NO circumstances kill off all fertile females in the entire civilization. Wrongdoers could be caught or killed because they were a tiny percentage of said society. You want towns to handle crime then there needs to be additional measures in place to allow them to do so. A person slowed after a murder could be hit with tools to murder them. A global chat for the town could better spread word and organize a resistance to an attack by griefers. A lasso could be used to temporary hold down a suspect for 5 minutes for questioning if a town suspected bad behavior. Those injured by knives or bows could have bleedout timers extended by 30 seconds giving more probability of them being healed by an advanced town. Again, a global chat in an advanced town would allow someone hurt outside town to name accuser and ask for help as they ran to the center of town giving the town time to gather the medical supplies.

All of these are great ideas. Right now justice is limited to what we're allowed to do with the tools, plus how much we're allowed to talk without speech bubbles covering each other. It's challenging when life is short. Whether Jason likes it or not, we do need a few more tools for dealing with griefers - and as much of an improvement as the curse system is, it's still insufficient.

Catfive · 2018-08-17 16:06:50

LaughAtlantis wrote:

willfrank84 wrote:
Whether Jason likes it or not,

He's been pretty clear that he intends it remaining 'as is' so yes this is the game. My advice is plan to have a weapon of your own in your backpack or hidden behind a wall/tree etc as one of the first things you aim for and kill problem players as they occur without getting into an in depth discussion about why they do what they do.

Lotus · 2018-08-17 16:40:24

Adding onto the "kill with unique items" idea...

You should be able to axe a cursed player with the help of two other players. If three people hit the cursed one with an axe in small time span, cursed one dies.

carbon · 2018-08-17 17:17:50

New contents — whatever they may be — added to the game will bring new elements and tactics.

Mad_Villager · 2018-08-17 17:34:55

People born with a curse can just keep quiet and people wont notice a curse. I vouch for the idea with Eve spawn with to many curses.

carbon · 2018-08-17 17:42:49

Mad_Villager wrote:

People born with a curse can just keep quiet and people wont notice a curse. I vouch for the idea with Eve spawn with to many curses.

One easy solution is to have the community be more explicit about having babies communicate after being named. Which is interesting, because quiet babies in real life is traditionally seen as abnormal behaviour.

pein · 2018-08-18 06:23:13

alice here

was a message for granma, the racist, shit talking coward who chases a kid because she told that a cistern near ponds is useless

by not doing anything during that shit show, you were defending her
justice was made

the only awful thing is your pvp skills and the lack of attention to your surroundings

and the bear was there, hence i wasnt the only one who was treated like that
sorry but not sorry for any of the dumb cocky players there

Trick · 2018-08-18 09:50:20

pein wrote:

alice here
was a message for granma, the racist, shit talking coward who chases a kid because she told that a cistern near ponds is useless
by not doing anything during that shit show, you were defending her
justice was made
the only awful thing is your pvp skills and the lack of attention to your surroundings
and the bear was there, hence i wasnt the only one who was treated like that
sorry but not sorry for any of the dumb cocky players there

I should have known. You're a pretty toxic player, and you seem to be proud of it.

Destroying an entire town because one player was unkind to you is vengeful and childish. None of the rest of us did anything to you. I had no idea your grandmother was unkind. Yet, you took it out on a bunch of innocent players.

Your shitty behaviour makes the game unenjoyable for others. Not sure how ruining the game for other players is fun for you, but it speaks to you as a person, IMO.

Trick · 2018-08-18 09:56:55

jasonrohrer wrote:

You guys are saying that there's simply no way to handle this problem yourselves, and you need me to handle it for you automatically.
In real life, there is no curse system, and no justice is automatic.
Justice is one of the most interesting aspects of civilization. It's a hard problem to solve. It may be THE main problem that civilization faces.
And here you are, facing it. It's tough! People are hard to catch. The innocent get hurt, and the perp often gets away. Some people feel bad for the perp and give them additional chances, etc.

Sounds like a really interesting problem to me. One that I don't want to solve for you.
The curse system is there to make up for the one small difference from real life: reincarnation.

If you have people in your village who are raising cursed babies, and you think that is wrong, what are you going to do about it? Argue with the parent? Kill or curse the parent? Start a committee to inspect every newborn baby in the village? Then a mother notices her cursed baby and rushes into the hills to hide it from the committee?
Interesting....

Sorry Jason, but real talk, that sounds like a giant cop-out. You know this is a problem, which is why you created the cursing system to begin with. It is not working the way it was intended (i.e., to discourage bad/toxic gameplay). If you don't actually care that the system you spent a bunch of time creating and implementing isn't working, then why not just remove it. What's the point? Obviously, you wanted the system to act as a deterrent, and since it isn't effectively doing that, it only makes sense to modify it in a way that achieves the intended purpose.

I get it, you've got a lot going on with this game. It's easier to shrug your shoulders and say "you deal with it". But toxic game environments destroy games. There's only so many times a person will tolerate being griefed before they find something else to do with their time, because everything they do in the game will get destroyed by some childish 12 year old boy anyway.

Telafiesta · 2018-08-18 10:47:30

You don't have to feed a quite child and you have the chance to arm yourself and deal with the devil child before they become an issue. If your town is being griefed over and over maybe you could be playing better or stop spawning as a boy and take the next generation into your own hands. I killed both black text children before they were age that spawned to me today, and I don't feel like it required any skill on my part to ask the baby "are you afk?" It takes a certain level of ignorance to spend 5 minuets writing a rant to fix a problem that you are a part of, instead of taking 5 minuets in game to check on the next generation. To counter a final thought "What about when they protect a cursed child, or my children aren't checking their children?" Easy curse and kill that mom, she will catch on quick if zero tolerance became the new norm.

MultiLife · 2018-08-18 11:34:19

Honestly, I don't think it would be too much to ask for a buff to the curse system, if it is, then okay, but I still think it could be better.
I personally am not asking to solve issues for me, I am voicing in on an opinion of a system not quite doing its job and could be boosted. I still like the 'Eve life punishment option', give the toxic players more cooldowns and cut their chain of spawning to cities and towns, I think they deserve that.

Overall I think it is just a question of balancing a 'newish' system: I think it could demand a bit less to activate and have a small punishing side to it to slow down toxic players.
For example, if I'd get cursed like five times and "doomed" to some Eve rounds, I wouldn't even mind as a normal "I play the game anyways" person, so if people would "over-curse", normal players would probably be quite okay (but I don't believe people would curse more if the cursing demanded less to activate, honestly).

Also, I baby test like a madman, and all the time I see others raising all babies at the other parts of the town. I don't have time to patrol the place and teach mothers to play differently, nor expect that to even work. Many mothers would probably just get angry at me for trying to dictate their gameplay or ignore my pleas.

Anyways, as I said, buff or not, I will still play, but I still think the system needs some balancing and would love some ways to isolate problematic players for some time to slow them down.

pein · 2018-08-18 16:35:33

Trick wrote:

pein wrote:
alice here
was a message for granma, the racist, shit talking coward who chases a kid because she told that a cistern near ponds is useless
by not doing anything during that shit show, you were defending her
justice was made
the only awful thing is your pvp skills and the lack of attention to your surroundings
and the bear was there, hence i wasnt the only one who was treated like that
sorry but not sorry for any of the dumb cocky players there
I should have known. You're a pretty toxic player, and you seem to be proud of it.
Destroying an entire town because one player was unkind to you is vengeful and childish. None of the rest of us did anything to you. I had no idea your grandmother was unkind. Yet, you took it out on a bunch of innocent players.
Your shitty behaviour makes the game unenjoyable for others. Not sure how ruining the game for other players is fun for you, but it speaks to you as a person, IMO.

your prejudice and stupidity shines
i should of live to 60 and bear her name to make her proud or what?
i also kill the eves who are asshole, and the towns where they sacrifice boys, etc.
ending your lineage means you wont go back to a city, so yeah, im happy i ruined her day, and you didnt lost anything on that shit camp
people burning butt logs and an empty cistern near 3 ponds with no bucket

gen 6 with a level of gen 2

i wouldnt say that others didnt do anything, cause they were pretty cocky about it until they met their ends
it took 2 minutes to kill 2 females, the little girl ran away at age 3.5, all she had to do is quit
when the two guys started cursing and telling that 'this scared her for a while'
on that point i decided that i settle it, all of you seen a stupid grandma chasing a kid with no reason, none of them did anything about it

guess what, im better at building stuff than you
and better and destoying it, so dont piss me off, if you curse someone, expect that you gonna get killed
you already accepted as a challange, you lost it, and come cry to forum like a whiny bitch

in other runs i kill off this dumb granmas so wont annoy the babies
you dont think about what you done, or what you havent done, just play the victim card
guess what, i was the victim of harassment and in return i proved her wrong, you were collateral damage

Trick · 2018-08-18 16:54:27

pein wrote:

Trick wrote:
pein wrote:
alice here
was a message for granma, the racist, shit talking coward who chases a kid because she told that a cistern near ponds is useless
by not doing anything during that shit show, you were defending her
justice was made
the only awful thing is your pvp skills and the lack of attention to your surroundings
and the bear was there, hence i wasnt the only one who was treated like that
sorry but not sorry for any of the dumb cocky players there
I should have known. You're a pretty toxic player, and you seem to be proud of it.
Destroying an entire town because one player was unkind to you is vengeful and childish. None of the rest of us did anything to you. I had no idea your grandmother was unkind. Yet, you took it out on a bunch of innocent players.
Your shitty behaviour makes the game unenjoyable for others. Not sure how ruining the game for other players is fun for you, but it speaks to you as a person, IMO.
your prejudice and stupidity shines
i should of live to 60 and bear her name to make her proud or what?
i also kill the eves who are asshole, and the towns where they sacrifice boys, etc.
ending your lineage means you wont go back to a city, so yeah, im happy i ruined her day, and you didnt lost anything on that shit camp
people burning butt logs and an empty cistern near 3 ponds with no bucket
gen 6 with a level of gen 2
i wouldnt say that others didnt do anything, cause they were pretty cocky about it until they met their ends
it took 2 minutes to kill 2 females, the little girl ran away at age 3.5, all she had to do is quit
when the two guys started cursing and telling that 'this scared her for a while'
on that point i decided that i settle it, all of you seen a stupid grandma chasing a kid with no reason, none of them did anything about it
guess what, im better at building stuff than you
and better and destoying it, so dont piss me off, if you curse someone, expect that you gonna get killed
you already accepted as a challange, you lost it, and come cry to forum like a whiny bitch
in other runs i kill off this dumb granmas so wont annoy the babies
you dont think about what you done, or what you havent done, just play the victim card
guess what, i was the victim of harassment and in return i proved her wrong, you were collateral damage

You genuinely sound like a child. How old are you?

Maybe I need to remind myself that I am playing with actual kids.

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#1 2018-08-17 09:17:16

Awful Players - The Curse System is NOT Working

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