Why Whites are Better than Blacks (ONLY in Ohol)

UnnoticedShadow · 2018-09-21 02:46:06

While the update fixing skin-tones was a good one, it brings one big problem, the fact that Gingers can only have woman as children makes them more valuable, and as they only come from whites, whites are more valuable. However, this also makes Indians and Africans worse, as Indians have a chance to have African children, which are only men, and because of this, blacks cannot have children, effectively making whites superior to blacks.

One way this can be fixed, is by making a Ginger have a 50% chance for when having a baby for it to be white, as Redhead Genetics are not very contagious anyways, and this would fix most of the issue with racism.

Although this is not a top priority issue, in families people will start valuing Lighter skin-tones over darker ones, and possibly even refuse to raise an Indian girl, in order to keep sure the Ginger only bloodline has a 95% chance of having girls, instead of the 45% chance of Indians.

(This algorithm is more theory based than fact base, so if anyone can prove this wrong, tell me

Last edited by UnnoticedShadow (2018-09-21 02:51:49)

Booklat1 · 2018-09-21 02:53:13

ooooor jason could add the rest of the characters in those ethnicities.

genetics can be really hard unless you have one or few systems that do anything, I think adding any "artificial" fix for these inheritance rates would only make it more problematic. Ethnicities could be inherited by basic quantitative genetics as they'd work better in haploid inheritance and in phenotypes distributed in a spectrum (like skin colour is). Later, if this system seemed insuficient more could be added to it almost effortlessly.

UnnoticedShadow · 2018-09-21 02:54:54

I just wish it was the other way around, because this can get pretty bad if people start exploiting this "feature"

Booklat1 · 2018-09-21 03:00:49

I agree. but this is in the top 5 list of things already added that need completing right?

i mean, after dogs, worms and pigs being useless this screams "fix me jason" eh?

Last edited by Booklat1 (2018-09-21 03:01:09)

boggers · 2018-09-21 03:32:05

Mitochondrial Eve was black. Just sayin.

Baker · 2018-09-21 04:19:10

But then the town becomes overpopulated.

gabal · 2018-09-21 04:46:18

I rarely see a town starving which has compost running, stew and ples. Infant mortality is high even with abundance of food and I don't see why would you abandon male children djece to overpopulation.

pein · 2018-09-21 06:52:55

as i said very often

skill over gender
if a kid is pro it doesnt matter
if medium skill people are more useful as males, they stress a lot as girls and forget baskets and carts out of camp

a town with men majority will work faster and make rooms, pens and tools much faster

a town with women majority just makes babies who are having more babies, eat, sponge and dont get anything done
also maybe your 4 year old girl would stay alive if you wouldnt feed the next 4 girls who eat all the food then die

you dont need 50 females same time, you actually need 1 each 20 minutes so the line keeps going
now you can have 1 more for assurance, but after you got 3 girls, and the first is still alive, let some die

is seriously annoying when im female and i see other females who spoil every girl and let every boy starve

maybe you just killed the pro player as a boy and nobody gonna make you tools
wont come back, or will come back and grief the town for starving him over and over

the only time i prefer having girls is eve runs. even if i got 9, not sure that i will have one alive so i keep them all
but if i see a smart one, i keep only one and replace it if it dies
technically when you got 3 daughters you should tell them to have only 1 girl alive at a time
or move out to make an outpost, keep 3-4 fertile females at a time, no more
boys cant have babies so they wont overpopulate

now how many jobs you got in a city?
1 shepherd, you could have 3 to cloth everybody
1-2 compost maker but pro players make 1-2 compost anyway
1 pie maker can feed adults
a few kids fixing berry
doctor useless, just know where the pads are
guard useless just have a weapon and communicate, be prepared
road makers maybe
a few hunters
i see pro players do all important jobs like get seeds, grow carrots, make compost
rarely see people doing one job for a life
stew making is useful but not when you got no axe yet, i think is just cosmetic/roleplay to have stew or burrito makers

now boots family had only girls so they can come back any time, even now a discord city needs girls mostly
but dont try to copy that, those are a bit more experienced people working fast

server1 randoms are very bad at coordinating and a lot of people leach on others
you might get 2-3 good player out of 20
even if you got 10 girls you will have the same amount of experienced people
one kiln one oven can support 1 family of like 12 people
and you would need a hunter and shepperd to clothe them up
once you got naked people it means you need population control
lot of people dont like to be the one left out but it improves the game experience having a smaller family

everybody knows each other and there are less murders, less stealing

so 3 girls at a time, wait until grandpa and grandma dies, then have a kid, then everone has some clothes and everyone is valuable

my first run today i seen 30 ginger girls and they give packs to them, 2 famines when berries were depleted, they kept giving packs to random babies, they run out they die, i brought back 3 packs and tried to give to adults who survived a famine
i asked babies to drop packs, one couldnt even drop it and i knew is a mistake to keep her alive, she made shoes and rabbit fur shawl later when we could of have some more packs and make wool clothes
nobody made compost and we just had more and more girls and it was a mess

this ginger towns are not fun
fear of getting your lineage lost cause no girls is understandable
but when you got 3 fertile females is no longer the case, dont go higher than that
wait 10 minutes, if some dies you can still have more females

learn to say no
learn to say have 1-2 girls maximum cause you got sisters
say we need hunters
say we need an outpost cause we got too many people

jasonrohrer · 2018-09-21 15:49:50

Yeah, this was an unintended side-effect of fixing this bug.

The bug was simple.... Ginger and dark character were marked with the wrong race. They were both marked as C (brown skin) instead of correctly as A and F.

I'll try to get another male and female into A and F next week to deal with this.

Tarr · 2018-09-21 16:21:04

I don't think we're actually going to get to the point of not raising darker skinned babies to save a family line instead we're just going to see family trees become gingers at the bottom. As lame as everyone being the same model is at least families aren't dying to seven+ boy rolls which I had happen twice in one day (feelsbadman).

At the very least it helps civs not die out and at the very worst is going to make an eve camp harder if your girls don't population control.

UnnoticedShadow · 2018-09-21 20:15:32

What you guys don't get is, girls ARE better than boys, in almost every situation. Just because you spawn in as a girl does not mean you have to take care of your babies, and choosing a boy over a girl is like refusing an Axe because it has the ability to chop down maple trees: Sure, it can be used for bad, but most of the time it will turn out useful. The only time being a female could ever backfire is if you're a noob, and if so you will probably learn pretty quickly.

Last edited by UnnoticedShadow (2018-09-21 20:20:09)

MultiLife · 2018-09-21 20:40:37

UnnoticedShadow wrote:

What you guys don't get is, girls ARE better than boys, in almost every situation. Just because you spawn in as a girl does not mean you have to take care of your babies

It's sad but true in this game. In real life we need males as much as we need females, but due to the virgin birth mechanic, males are really left in the dust ability-wise. Sadly. I wish they were just as essential but well, it's a game.

pein · 2018-09-21 21:08:12

UnnoticedShadow wrote:

What you guys don't get is, girls ARE better than boys, in almost every situation. Just because you spawn in as a girl does not mean you have to take care of your babies, and choosing a boy over a girl is like refusing an Axe because it has the ability to chop down maple trees: Sure, it can be used for bad, but most of the time it will turn out useful. The only time being a male could ever backfire is if you're a noob, and if so you will probably learn pretty quickly.

oh i get it, just experience shows they never do it
they keep every baby cause they deserve a chance, nobody thinks about taking away chance from others
its not a big problem for me if i only care about myself, but its a problem to my kids cause im forced to abandon them cause others wont
and its a problem to the pro players who see a lot of babies and suicide and all you left with is noobs who you need to tend for

your methaphor is more like: refusing a hoe when you got other hoes, cause you might need a hoe later, but making only hoes prevents you from having adze and froh to make carts, so even if you dont have to worry about tilling soil, you wont have soil to till without carts and having a shovel to compost

its easy to raise a kid, if its smart, if that life is for her ok, you can afford it maybe, but its not only your choice
i dont trust people for making decisions in my name, i dont trust my girl that it will listen to me when i say dont keep babies for 5 minutes, all i see is people who wouldnt be alive without your work, acting like an equal to you and dont even understand why you kill a griefer, automatically assumes that you are evil without the knowledge who made the camp, who is making bow to kill others, etc.

its not if, its when
when you got too many noob girls, others cant explain what to not do and repair their mistakes or preventing them do it

your kid your responsibility
you got to produce enough food for them, you cannot just ignore other kids cause they are not yours, they are players, they need clothing, purpose
abandoning a kid means he loses 1 minute, raising up without resources means you make them lose 7-8 minutes
now guess who comes back 7 minutes later? the same player
dont divide resources if you dont produce them

also the topic is pretty funny cause gingers are black technically, thats why they can have only ginger girls, apart from a few off category ones
jason told he missed the color with the type, supposed to be A and F
so next time he will add new A and F type characters, yeah black girl and ginger boy

boggers · 2018-09-21 21:35:31

UnnoticedShadow wrote:

What you guys don't get is, girls ARE better than boys, in almost every situation. Just because you spawn in as a girl does not mean you have to take care of your babies, and choosing a boy over a girl is like refusing an Axe because it has the ability to chop down maple trees: Sure, it can be used for bad, but most of the time it will turn out useful. The only time being a female could ever backfire is if you're a noob, and if so you will probably learn pretty quickly.

Nah. There are plenty of situations where its better to be male.

Ever have a kid in the middle of smithing and have it completely waste the firing by running around you shouting "F" so you cant pick anything up?

What if you are out trapping, or halfway to the mine with an empty cart when you drop one? Do you throw away what you're doing, or throw away the kid? What if you have a kid while hunting bears?

The years where you have the most pips and can do more between eating coincide with the years you are fertile. Add to this if you do not immediately stop what you are doing and pay attention to the kid, the kid is highly likely to suicide, so you might as well not be female if you have to carry something outside of base.

The rationale I see all the time when left to die as a boy is "we dont have enough food" That's OK! Males should not be eating in the camp anyway when there is plenty of wild food 50m outside of camp.

You don't have enough to feed one more now so you kill the players most likely to bring food and resources back to camp... will you have enough food for 6 more when your daughters start having daughters?

UnnoticedShadow · 2018-09-21 21:51:33

Pein, about your metaphor where having more hoes prevents you from making Adzes, this is different as it does not cost extra to take care of a female over a male, and as I said before, you don't have to take care of children, it is an option, but one men don't have. Sure, it might be annoying if as the only girl you have a child on an expedition, but ALWAYS better than having no woman in the bloodline, and no children.

And in a situation where you do have a lot of people in the village and have a baby on an expedition, you can just ignore it, which in EVERY case is better than not having the option. The only valid point I saw was about Forging, and the pros are WAY bigger in order to outweigh something that situational.

Last edited by UnnoticedShadow (2018-09-21 21:52:10)

boggers · 2018-09-21 22:16:02

UnnoticedShadow wrote:

And in a situation where you do have a lot of people in the village and have a baby on an expedition, you can just ignore it, which in EVERY case is better than not having the option. The only valid point I saw was about Forging, and the pros are WAY bigger in order to outweigh something that situational.

OK the situation is this: Your noob aunts ran out of soil, ate all the berries and died of famine. When food was getting low they starved the boys first. Then you are born, the only survivor in your generation, but you have no soil, and when your hoe breaks there is no iron. The only person left who can go out exploring and fix it (you) is now the same person who needs to stay in base and have more kids to repopulate, but you cant feed them, because you still have have no berries and no soil. You might as well not be female at that point... you would have been better off being born as one of the males who was killed 10 minutes earlier, they could have saved the town by now.

pein · 2018-09-22 02:04:25

no its exactly it, men wont overpopulate so you dont have to worry about them, and if you go to keeping kids like 'they surely can feed themselves', than you already know that there arent enough good people and arent big chances you get some
my solution is to let any kid who moves, who points on things die, they waste as a baby, they will waste as an adult, gender doesnt matter, its even a negative to be femae when we got enough of them

you dont have to but others will take care, exactly 14 minutes later you doom the whole lineage, especially if you keep even more girls

its same as medium heat, the curve is stronger on the middle, it makes sense irl, its a good game element, if you fry your kid would grow faster everybody would do it, now only noobs do it because of misinformation
same goes for spoiling based on gender, a boy works his ass off and you limit him to making food and never leave the camp and give a girl a backpack she never uses, often even loses it

you wont get more babies because you got more females, im pretty sure 3 females get same amount of kids as 4, you can have like 12 kids as a lady and its highly dependent on players online, now on low server population and multiple camps people go to multiple places so instead of 12 kids you get 6 kids each per female, now this is frustrating for females, even to one who like to be females
not sure, i lose track after 8 and i hate to repeat myself, but on low pop i make sure my kids know what is where and what we need
spoiling your own kids, not keeping track of other kids, all things which mess camps up even more

now you got babies incoming and got food, you give life to Bumpy, Bumpy dies in 2 minutes near food, born back, you raise her again and again. you dont know is Bumpy again, you think is a different player, you dont actually get 10 kids, you get 5 kids just like other times, you get bumpy back 5 times and shes happy to be raised and try again

not just forging, i had a kid on the point i tried to stab the serial killer, i could of chosen to not care about her, she was all 'oh i only kill the ones who attack me', the kid lagged me out and messed me up so i was shot mid animation
you can maybe value a kid more than a basket but not more than a cart
but often that basket gets forgotten and the kid will be useless
i often just take back a kid then someone distracts me from going back to my project, all this paused jobs and forgotten resources wont be found by others most cases

its not that situational
im looking for skilled players to share the work mount with and coordinate
there is a point when i get frustrated with babies
you can click any fast, you can explore and see the city, you cant keep track of what 8 idiots are doing and you cannot fix it, help them to fix it or prevent it

more people are more trouble
starving babies can invite trouble
killing males gonna be surely trouble

there are margins when its slightly annoying to the point when is very annoying, i had many lifes with 3-4 famines where people die out then overpopulate again and im like cant do much about it

the gingers got the same chance to have non gingers, but instead of having boys they gonna have ginger girls, then next generation this turns into a clown fiesta
yeah, it is a defense agains lineage killers and noob girls

i would say that coordination between the pro players is every time more effective than increasing population and try to increase outputs that way

in terms of meta, if you see a ginger girl, you need to increase the amount of bowls and teach them more, like planting corn and making extra bowls. while this is not effective most cases, with a lot of ginger babies, can save on food and give them a purpose
also you will have more girls so less kids per girls, than more time to teach them how to feed themselves, and use the workforce to gather firewood and plant and process corn, it will increase the pressure on soil, water and composting anyway, and most population will be naked

FeverDog · 2018-09-24 11:25:43

Man, I would love to see a Pein authored guide book. I'll volunteer to edit one for you if you agree... Your advice/guidance is the best.

Anshin · 2018-09-24 11:33:44

This has been fixed:

jasonrohrer wrote:

Fixed server code so that any race with less than 4 members will not have same-race babies.
Thus, red-head character is a rarity now and not stable in terms of offspring. She used to be an attractor.

https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=3943

Anshin · 2018-09-24 11:42:39

Although until a black lady and ginger man are added it's still unbalanced.

New character types really should come in male+female pairs to avoid this sort of rhetoric.

betame · 2018-09-24 16:39:16

Are there any data crunchers who want to prove if female societies were better than average?
During the week of red-head towns, we all saw the longest lineage was 51. Any data on other red-head lineages? or on how the average lineage length compared to a typical week?
This is a great case study opportunity for the male/female debate.

(True, even with the hotfix, it sounds like lighter skinned groups are slightly more likely to have women than darker skinned groups for now)

Also a quick note that race=/=ethnicity=/=nationality/origin, as was mistaken at the beginning of the thread.

InSpace · 2018-09-24 16:48:48

Yay, two more characters!

Catfive · 2018-09-24 21:51:45

If I am male I will gather further afield, rarely impact a town's food supply as i can easily setup a dozen compost uninteruppted, go hunt troublesome bears/snakes/people, restock iron from miles away etc etc. As a female every job you take on is exponentially harder unless there is a wet nurse handling all the kids and even then you run the risk of a famine fast approaching. Pop control of females has a lot to be said for it, especially if they are 'on welfare'.

pein · 2018-09-24 23:35:28

well you can easily check any female town, add up the average years per person
more boys more average years lived per kid

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#1 2018-09-21 02:46:06

Why Whites are Better than Blacks (ONLY in Ohol)

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