One Hour One Life Forums

Cecil

Member

Registered: 2018-07-16

Posts: 55

New animal suggestion: Rats

There's one animal that has followed human civilization, which is not represented in the game, and that's the rat.

Rats have a purpose to serve in One Hour One Life. Big bases often have a trash problem. Every tile has an item on it. Food components litter the forge, kitchen and farm area. If food items had a tiny chance to attract or spawn rats, big bases would inevitably end up getting rats from the sheer amount of food lying around.

Exactly what threat rats would represent isn't something I have a strong opinion about. Maybe they eat or steal discarded food, maybe they bite people to inconvenience them, maybe they have a chance to spread disease.

This would give people incentive to organize better and pack away food in containers like baskets, and boxes. Though rats shouldn't just be there to force people to clean. Bases could decide to chase away the rats instead. Maybe players could deal with the rats directly with weapons, though I think this is actually would be an excuse to have dogs do something.

Cartoons have taught us that cats eat rats, but historically, dogs were employed to get rid of vermin. We kept dogs on our ships and farms, and they in turn kept rats and other scavengers away. Dogs currently serve no function in the game, yet they too have been a staple in many civilizations. What if their mere presence kept rats from spawning, or maybe they could have an interaction where they chase and kill rats.

Rats would make bigger bases harder to manage, which I completely understand if you guys are not on board with, but it would also let new players feel useful just through an easy new job like making baskets and storing food, and it would give experienced players an excuse to risk their lives to get dogs.

I understand that technically this would be tricky since animals and items on the same tile don't work well. So adding an animal that only shows up when every tile is occupied would pose problems. Maybe a food item could simply be replaced by a rat, and they remove food if they end their movement on a tile with food on it? I don't know... I don't want to pretend I know how to make a game. I'm just trying to make rats seem viable.

Last edited by Cecil (2018-11-24 05:07:21)

Psykout

Member

Registered: 2018-11-14

Posts: 353

Re: New animal suggestion: Rats

Where are you getting these facts from? Rats became a problem when humans starting agriculture which is roughly 10,000-11,000 years ago. The first undisputed case of a domesticated dog that was buried with it's "owner" was 14,200 years ago, long before agriculture. First time we have noticed a cat buried with its "owner" was about 9,500 years ago - which fits the rise of agriculture way better. Cave depictions from the stone age show hunters leashed to canines, I am just gonna go ahead and say they were hunting partners LONG before vermin control, hence why we purposefully bred dogs for that reason rather than it being a natural feature.

If rats were added 100% it would because disease is added and they are carriers. There is no denying that was the main problem with rat infestations is that they carry zoonotic diseases, and did so rampantly during certain booms of human population and agriculture increases. The fact you don't feel strongly about this makes me wonder how much thought has been involved, and what angle you are coming from. Do you want rats added because its a cool introduction and can bring in communicable diseases, or simply to combat unorganized camps. You say shouldn't be there to force people to clean but its the only real point you referenced in your thread, multiple times. You say you want rats to be viable, but you yourself don't even know why you want them to be. Not trying to rip you apart, just asking questions and mentioning things I see so you can think about it.

Animals right now are considered objects. When a player is nearby they become active and the server does its work. When no one is nearby they shut off, and become a rock, while the server does other work. EVERY single rat that EVER spawns will have to be managed and path'd and "drawn" by the server because they would be spawned in bases as per your suggestion. It would be one of the biggest hits you could add to the server for an animal. Having an exact goal for adding them, and coming up with alternative means is important.

"Big" bases have this problem because the sheer lack of management and tidyness makes them big for no reason. No real advanced villages that contain most of the available tech have an item on every tile, because people manage them like that. The Forge is its own room with walls and chests, far from the kitchen. The kitchen is lined with chests, and people drop off their plates inside it when they pass by, which is then stacked by the kitchen worker. This constant attention keeps them clean, and newer players seeing this end up following eventually. Gonna live to 60 this play thru? When those last fives years when you need to be near food to not starve - teach the babies and clean up some stuff, monkey see monkey do.

If you are really looking for a purpose for a dog outside of something cute that follows me around - I would say they give you one free pass when it comes to an animal attack. They take the bullet (which they actually do in our society right now) and you get to live. Maybe give you the chance to use medical supplies on them to save them if that feels heartless, but considering how many babies are left to die, I would get a heck of a chuckle if that was needed to be added.

P.S - If diseases are added it should start with Sheep Dung and then maybe move to overabundance of food/decayed food long before creating a new animal just for it. I have advocated that moving through sheep dung has a small chance of making you sick, which then can be spread to some one else that shares a tile with you.

*Eating old food (least favorite because of how time passes in game - annoying to code I bet, convoluted and not clear cut, also when does it happen. Food not decaying at all is in the same boat of food that doesn't rot for 50 years. If you make food go bad every 15 minutes say goodbye to 80% of new camps.)

*Not having a varied diet (also not preferred because of similar reasons as food decay - plus we have Yum bonus to push that, and I like the positive reinforcement because its not common.)

*Unsanitary conditions (un buried graves and sheep dung;piled up in the pen or just all over the camp because no pen; both say HIIIIIII) ~ My most favorite because everything is already in the game

*Edits for too many 'All your Base' moments because I was thinking faster than I was typing, just got done with work and it's late

Last edited by Psykout (2018-11-24 08:39:43)

Rebel

Member

Registered: 2018-03-28

Posts: 120

Re: New animal suggestion: Rats

I can rats just being a reskin of mosquitos, on a different biome but give the plague (which Psykout said) would pass to others who share the same tile space (can totally see this being used to kill of villages by bad people tho).

I would like to see rats spawning due to food left on tiles, not in baskets or boxes/carts. this could be another reason to push technology and to generally be tidier.

messy camps are the worst, and I am all for adding a feature to encourage players to store things nicely.

Cecil

Member

Registered: 2018-07-16

Posts: 55

Re: New animal suggestion: Rats

Yeah, I suppose they could be an intentional omission because there's a future biome they'd be well suited for. In that case, maybe we could just achieve the same thing with some sort of food spoilage.

Psykout

Member

Registered: 2018-11-14

Posts: 353

Re: New animal suggestion: Rats

Yeah, I suppose they could be an intentional omission because there's a future biome they'd be well suited for. In that case, maybe we could just achieve the same thing with some sort of food spoilage.

Food spoilage is tricky, because when do you make the cut off as I said. If you want to curb advanced settlements you have to be delicate otherwise you are making getting there harder on top of being there much harder. This is why I believe communicable diseases is a future goal meant to only affect advanced settlements - which is easier to tie to animal husbandry rather than food production. If at some point the community does not put time into preparing medical supplies, they run the risk of a communicable disease wiping them out, and would not effect early settlements. The sheer size of advanced settlements would fall into this logic versus the handful needed to advance an Eve camp.

Rebel

Member

Registered: 2018-03-28

Posts: 120

Re: New animal suggestion: Rats

Yeah, I suppose they could be an intentional omission because there's a future biome they'd be well suited for. In that case, maybe we could just achieve the same thing with some sort of food spoilage.

Food spoilage is tricky, because when do you make the cut off as I said. If you want to curb advanced settlements you have to be delicate otherwise you are making getting there harder on top of being there much harder. This is why I believe communicable diseases is a future goal meant to only affect advanced settlements - which is easier to tie to animal husbandry rather than food production. If at some point the community does not put time into preparing medical supplies, they run the risk of a communicable disease wiping them out, and would not effect early settlements. The sheer size of advanced settlements would fall into this logic versus the handful needed to advance an Eve camp.

I think there is a way to add spoilage in, but also have benefits.

EG not spoilage but "aging"
such that pie decrease in food pips the longer they are left (meaning people need to cook, then eat them).
and such that there would increase in pips on other foods, like aged meat or stew.

EG, its better to leave stew for a few mins before eating for better pips, or eat it straight away for normal pips.

and have other foods decrease in value, "old pie", "old bread" etc, and veg should just decay if left on the floor to too long.

NOTE: this is just me throwing ideas about to start a discussion, and i know this isn't a thread about food spoilage.

lionon

Member

Registered: 2018-11-19

Posts: 532

Re: New animal suggestion: Rats

Or simply have the despawn timer age differently if left on the floor vs. in a basket vs. in a box.

Psykout

Member

Registered: 2018-11-14

Posts: 353

Re: New animal suggestion: Rats

Again, why is food spoilage desired, and what alternatives are there to achieve this goal? Food spoilage is pandora's box in my opinion, would rather leave that closed for now.

Anshin

Member

Registered: 2018-04-01

Posts: 614

Re: New animal suggestion: Rats

Fun Fact: It turns out Ratatouille was wrong!

'Gerbils replace rats' as main cause of Black Death

---

GENETICS PLEASE!

Cecil

Member

Registered: 2018-07-16

Posts: 55

Re: New animal suggestion: Rats

I wasn't aware of this before, but apparently sheep eat carrots they find in the environment. Rats seem feasible then since that means they can do the same thing with foods. Just depends if they're a desired addition.

Last edited by Cecil (2018-11-27 07:04:23)

Psykout

Member

Registered: 2018-11-14

Posts: 353

Re: New animal suggestion: Rats

messy camps are the worst, and I am all for adding a feature to encourage players to store things nicely.

This feels like treating symptoms instead of the cause, a band-aid fix, except this band aid could kill you. You are believing in the stick instead of the carrot, its negative reinforcement which has its own merits, but can also backfire. I'd rather teach people to be efficient and clean, and have praise be the outcome. Do this because its for a good cause, rather than don't do this or this bad thing will happen. Apples and Oranges as is most psychology.

Rebel

Member

Registered: 2018-03-28

Posts: 120

Re: New animal suggestion: Rats

messy camps are the worst, and I am all for adding a feature to encourage players to store things nicely.

This feels like treating symptoms instead of the cause, a band-aid fix, except this band aid could kill you. You are believing in the stick instead of the carrot, its negative reinforcement which has its own merits, but can also backfire. I'd rather teach people to be efficient and clean, and have praise be the outcome. Do this because its for a good cause, rather than don't do this or this bad thing will happen. Apples and Oranges as is most psychology.

Well I see it as a reward XD, clean up and you are rewarding the pleasure of not having rats about. No i do agree, There is likely a better way to stop people for being messy, more containers, more stockpiles, more trashable items.

Teaching doesn't work, people will always be messy if there is not negative or positive reason to not be, I once cleaned a whole town, stockpiled everything that could, threw away everything that could be trashed and stored tools in containers, But guess what, once i had kids and told them to "Hey, keep things in containers or stacks don't leave things laying around" and presided to show them the clean town, few mins later i see plates laying in tiles right next to stacks or plates, aswell as other easily avoidable clutter.

I am just fed up having to clean because every tile in the village has something on it.

Also, why do people make everything so close together, I have been trying to teach people to build with alot of space and make roads to "buildings/workspaces" but for some reason i always see the forge bakery farm and sheep pen all clustered together which makes even more mess. I have seen a few towns where there has been 10-20 tiles between each work space and it was lovely.