Presumption of Innocence?

Atticus · 2018-03-22 21:40:44

First of all, I'd like to apologize to the player whose character I accidentally killed.

While I was trying to put away the knife to feed myself, I killed my son who just moved to the empty spot. I shouted mistake right after but it was not seen by anyone because everyone was looking at the bloody knife in my hand. I have not killed anyone before so I was a bit dumbfounded, I didn't think of the consequences of that mistake. A few seconds later a lady with a bow and arrow shot me without any warning.

I was a contributing member, made clothes for a few people and I was still young to have babies. I could still be valuable. I immediately thought they should have given me a few seconds to explain myself. Though, after a few minutes, I realized, considering that a griefer alone could undo what a dozen people build, why would they take the risk?

Maybe we don't have the luxury to ask "why you killed them?" at this stage of the game, or do we? What do you do when you see someone with a bloody knife?

Last edited by Atticus (2018-03-22 21:41:55)

Mortan · 2018-03-22 21:59:46

No, we clearly don't have the luxury to stand around and type, while the (presumed) griefer might be heading for us or our family members. Just be more careful swinging your knife with other people around.

masamune0 · 2018-03-22 22:18:35

Depends, if I know the person and knows he's working, I will listen to him but otherwise for me it is a red flag and I won't really hesitate. Depends on his reaction too, if he keeps moving, trying to murder others or if he says just after the kill "wait will explain", and put the knife on ground or something, then I will listen but...

That's harsh, you have no big vision so it is very risky... And you die really easily too.

Thorware · 2018-03-22 22:19:02

Getting killed seems like a reasonable consequence for your mistake. Remember that in this game death is not such a terrible thing, since we will all die after one hour anyway. Maybe you were looking forward to the second half hour in that particular village, but oh well, just start a new life.

I tend to preemptively kill anyone who shows signs of being a griefer, such as stalking around, holding/packing weapons, and not contributing.

Xuhybrid · 2018-03-22 22:37:01

There's no room for error. You kill the griefer or you all die. Sorry.

Someone was making a knife blade near me so i swooped in and took it and hid it. They may not have had any bad motives but i stopped that griefer in their tracks, in my eyes.

Last edited by Xuhybrid (2018-03-22 22:38:47)

EmmyGamba · 2018-03-22 22:46:58

Thorware wrote:

I tend to preemptively kill anyone who shows signs of being a griefer, such as stalking around, holding/packing weapons, and not contributing.

Killing someone should always be the last resort.

The chances that you kill someone innocent just because he acts suspicous are pretty high. I'm so sick of people that are not even griefers themselfes killing each other for the most silly reasons. Seen so many villages going to waste already because of that.

You just open actual griefers the door to unleash their chaos without anyone beeing able to tell who's friend or foe anymore.

Last edited by EmmyGamba (2018-03-22 22:47:48)

Jafa84 · 2018-03-22 23:07:02

*gets born*
loving family good farming big town lots of happy Peopel.
just learn to eat. they tell me about big farm to the South.
*hear splating sounds*
one and one more soon all dead, women with bow and black hair killing everyone.

i run to the South tell every one (no one even care) i get some food and sneek back North
the killer is still there running around.

i run out and hid with some berry bushes until i get big.
i go gets carts of food, the killer still running checking that everyone is dead.
I steal a knife and hid i in my backpack.

i run out 4-5 times get food and have 4 baby's(one run away probably because i was not in a town)
i tell them to survive to all cost and tell them abut killer and abut the farm town South.

my kids get big and start getting stuff, One go North to never bee seen again. last two start building up the town.
Everything seems good some People come back, but i keep my eyes open.

I go to my oldest kid that i talk to the most, i say he get my secret power to protect every one... he just dies in front of me starved..
so i go to the younger one and talk i ask her if she will take care of any grand kids she will get, she say yes and i give her my backpack with knife..

ahh maybe all will be all right after all...

she stabs me i die...
the end

This game is not for anyone with problems with hardcore game and permadeath.

Last edited by Jafa84 (2018-03-22 23:08:08)

Atticus · 2018-03-23 06:01:47

Thanks for the input everyone.

I believe separating non-griefers from griefers is one of the issues that we need to solve along with managing farm, population etc. Imagine you found someone with a bloody knife, there is a bow and arrow close by. You go and pick them up. When you return to the scene the culprit is still carrying the knife but not chasing others.

We can ask them to drop the knife. If they don't then it is clear that they are a griefer. Shoot them.

Then we can ask what was the reason to kill that person. Responses could include:

a) The person I killed was a griefer (Take the knife and let them live?)
b) It was a mistake (Don't take the risk and kill? I guess it depends on the size of the town and how much we might need that person in case they are telling the truth)
c) The person I killed was just eating but not contributing (According to whom, maybe they were contributing as much as they could and also learn from others, this shouldn't be a good reason to kill a person. So I'd try to teach the killer why they should not do that again)
d) The person I killed picked a berry from a full domestic gooseberry bush or picked milkweed at the wrong stage (They should have tried to teach them instead of killing, so same as (c))

The list could go on. However, there is not much time to think and act in the best possible way in these situations. So I think we should come up with a system for handling cases like these beforehand.

How would you handle such cases? Can you think of any system that would minimize the loss of progress?

Joriom · 2018-03-23 06:27:48

@Atticus
Just stab anyone who does not respond to long distance hails over voice chat with X on in-game chat. So simple. And it works.

RunnersShade · 2018-03-23 06:59:46

Just a small story, which was beyond frustrating, but also comical.

First life of the day, I made it to about...20 years? It was this big, bustling, thriving village that probably could have made it many more generations. My mom laid out the story and all the rules very well--However, an issue arises.
My sister had just became old enough to use weapons.
I just got really accustomed to the town, and was having an honest to gods blast, it was fun and there was actually some roleplaying going on.
This village however, had 3 arrows and one knife. No more, no less. This was for the purpose of of being able to kill bears and wolves, then also being able to skin them with the knife. In hindsight, this was a huge f'ing mistake.
Almost everyone was fully clothed, including a backpack. She was able to keep a knife and 2 arrows in her pack, then hold the bow and arrow. I don't know how she got a hold of these, but she did.

Next thing I know, everyone left and right is dying. She was stone cold silent, while everyone was yelling stuff like "Run!" "I love you!" "Where's mom?!"
Speaking of which, I saw my mom get stabbed.
my last words were "Why are you doing this sis?" Nothing. She came for me.
I ran in zags, knowing I'd either die by her hands, or shortly starve since I didn't have food on me.
I was slain by a knife stab.

I left that game with a bitter taste in my mouth, just frustrated with this game. I had yet to make it above 40 years old that day.
The very next game I got in was also a decent town, and it grew on me. That being said, shit happens sometimes.
I was on organizing duty, keeping things clean and mess free. I found a random arrow, and a random bow. picked em up, was about to find a place near the children's fire (since this town decidedly wanted to keep the children safe in case a griefer came along)
I was just about to set it down because I was at 3 hunger left, and the kids were all out of the way.
I just got done telling this story to the kids and my sister.

But then, there was a kid there as soon as I was putting the bow down. The space in front of me that wasn't occupied by anything was suddenly occupied by a kid. My sisters first and currently only kid. I shot my sisters child.
I apologized as much as I could, offered up my life if she decided she needed to take it. luckily she forgave me, and we carried on.
That life, however, I was trolled cause I was dying of starvation and told someone to move so I can get food out of the basket but they wouldn't, so I ended up starving to death at 39 years old. arggg.

Mostly I share this because sometimes, griefing needs to be shut down immediately, other times was a small accident and should be treated differently.

Joriom · 2018-03-23 08:22:40

@RunnersShade
Sadly, with current way of chat and FOV - if you try to ask grieffer questions - its to late, you're dead. So shoot first, ask questions late. When someone makes mistake though - he is dead with this logic. So ask first. But if hes a griefer, you are dead... endless loop. Shoot first seems to do less harm. One person punished for mistake is better than entire village dying because you hesitated when you had chance.

EmmyGamba · 2018-03-23 10:34:34

The funny thing is that entire villages die even when there wasn't any griefer in the first place. One guy starts to shoot "suspicious" people, another person sees that and thinks he's the bad guy - and the chaos begins! The more weapons around, the greater the damage.

Had that happen yesterday, when a self-proclaimed town guard called me "griefer" and shot me right after that. Probably because I grabbed a bow to go hunting. When I respawned there to get my revenge I was suprised to see that people were still fighting. Bloody corpses everywhere while my mother tells me "Dont worry I keep you safe"

lmao

Joriom · 2018-03-23 10:38:51

@EmmyGamba

And thats actually quite realistic. You can observe such developement of events even is real life when there is potential threat and people start to panic. Everyone blaming everyone. Curses starting to fly in the air. Fists go to use first. Then weapons. Then total chaos.

EmmyGamba · 2018-03-23 10:41:57

Yeah

Its quite facinating to see how well some human behaviors translate into this game

Kitaelia · 2018-03-23 11:03:59

This game is one huge social experiment and I love it!

Today I had an interesting Roleplay experience where my younger sister was jealous of me because she wanted to be the only baby maker in the town.. Mom had already grown old and couldn't produce any more kids. Had lots of boys. Me and Sis were the last hope! ...Sis Killed me after stating "There can only be one!"

Erudaru · 2018-03-23 11:12:43

No time for questions. I know this and still, always ask for an explanation, maybe they are a griever, maybe they killed a griever, maybe they dug out all berries to make a new berry farm....

I'm too naive and that's a mistake. Killing an innocent person is less damage than keeping a griever alive.

And sometimes they do explain and justify their actions like "I had to do it, he tried to kill me" but if you weren't there to witness it, you have to assume that it's a lie.

One Hour One Life Forums

#1 2018-03-22 21:40:44

Presumption of Innocence?

#2 2018-03-22 21:59:46

Re: Presumption of Innocence?

#3 2018-03-22 22:18:35

Re: Presumption of Innocence?

#4 2018-03-22 22:19:02

Re: Presumption of Innocence?

#5 2018-03-22 22:37:01

Re: Presumption of Innocence?

#6 2018-03-22 22:46:58

Re: Presumption of Innocence?

#7 2018-03-22 23:07:02

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#8 2018-03-23 06:01:47

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#9 2018-03-23 06:27:48

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#10 2018-03-23 06:59:46

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#11 2018-03-23 08:22:40

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#12 2018-03-23 10:34:34

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#13 2018-03-23 10:38:51

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#14 2018-03-23 10:41:57

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#15 2018-03-23 11:03:59

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#16 2018-03-23 11:12:43

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