Ways to make EVERY life precious

mrbah · 2019-05-15 14:04:13

I actually like the idea of life tokens, maybe mainly, because it fits my playstyle anyways.

My suggestion:
When a player has used up all their tokens (hide how many tokens a player has), make them spawn in the middle of nowhere as a man (or infertile female) unable to hear the belltower.

DestinyCall · 2019-05-15 15:21:05

RodneyC86 wrote:

I think dying multiple times, no matter how seemingly valuable a life is to an outside observer, will desensitize a player regarding death. Veterans on this board probably have died a few thousand times, a good portion of then probably quite exciting. But even then....it becomes meh

I think this is a big part of the situation. If you play OHOL repeatedly for days, weeks, months, years .... you will experience thousands of unique individual lives. But every one of those lives will not be precious and extraordinary. Most of those lives will be similar, even repetitive, maybe boring. The first time you make compost, it is a fun and interesting challenge because you are learning a new skill and gaining mastery over an important job that is helpful to the village. The five hundredth time you spend your life making compost, it just feels like drudgery and you'd probably rather be doing something else, but the village needs dirt and no one else was willing to do the job. If your only major accomplishment in that life was "made a lot of dirt piles", you probably won't look back on your memories of that life and feel nostalgic.

Likewise, the first time you are the last person left alive in a village or the first time you are the victim of a random act of violence or the first time your baby dies in your arms will feel significant and terrible. But the third time it happens, it will start to feel familiar. The thirtieth time it happens it will have become routine. And the three hundredth time you deal with one of these personal tragedies it will have become almost inconsequential. As a new player, you will probably care about each life much more deeply than a veteran player, because each life will bring with it many new experiences. Many things will happen to you for the very first time. Everything is fresh and new. But if you have been playing life after life, you might get to a point where you don't want to play in early villages anymore, because they are all pretty much the same. Or you might reach a point where you don't want to deal with hectic big-city life, because they are messy and full of griefers. Each life is technically a different experience, but if you play enough, each life is pretty much the same ... it follows the same path from start to finish. The lives that really stick with you later are those rare lives where you experience something special or unique. And that just isn't possible every single time you play. Some lives are going to be too short. Other lives are going to be too mundane and uneventful. And still other lives will be too similar to your previous lives.

As an example of this ... earlier this week, I logged onto the game after the server update caused a lot of Eves to spawn at the same time. There were a bunch of Eves in close proximity to each other, all speaking different languages and struggling to start functional camps before the limited wild food ran out. I was abandoned by a wandering Eve who was already over-burdened with other kids and chose to /die from the next Eve to give her a chance at a female baby, then I was born into a fledgling Eve camp where I managed to make it to age five before I died from the lack of wild food. I was born again as a male baby and decided to stick it out this time, but my mother and sister both died. There was another Eve camp nearby, but they spoke a different language from me, so I couldn't ask them if they wanted me to join them. The camp was so new that it probably wouldn't help to give them another mouth to feed and the Eve already had enough children, so I let myself die. I was reborn as an Eve and ran about for a bit, looking for a decent spot while juggling babies, but the nearby areas were mostly picked clean and covered with skeletons from previous failed Eves. Eventually I starved. This continued for a while, life after short life, until I was reborn to another wandering Eve who asked if I wanted to live. I said "Y" but to be honest, I didn't really care if I lived or died at that point. I was male and this Eve didn't even have a camp yet. It wasn't going to be an easy life and would probably end as abruptly and tragically as the last few lives. My mother ran to the east through badlands, hunting for fresh territory, further away from the Eve madness. I grew old enough to carry a basket and followed her as best I could. A little sister was born and our mom left us for a bit to hunt for supplies. My sister almost died, because it took too long for our mom to return (twice!), but I was able to keep her alive with berries. Eventually, she was big enough to carry a basket and we followed mom for a bit. Then I noticed a seal and decided to hunt for some clothing. With my sister's help, I got a seal skin, but our mother didn't wait for us. She died in the swamp to the east a short time later. We never found her body. Not sure if she died of starvation or boar attack. After that, it was just me and my sister. We ran together, with the help of zoom mod, and kept hunting for a good spot to settle down. We picked up tools from a dead camp and I made my sister a skirt from rope we found along the way. Later I hunted another seal so we were both properly dressed.

It took decades, but we eventually found a nice spot, miles and miles from our starting point. By this point, my sister was in her late twenties and had not had any children. I was a little worried, but at least we had a home now. We started setting up a nice little camp. I gathered clay and adobe for a furnace, set down a home marker, made kindling, and set a snare to hunt rabbits. I came back to check on the camp and it was looking pretty good. We had a decent stack of kindling and wet bowls/plates ready to fire. A small stack of iron and enough food to keep the two of us alive for the rest of our lives. But ... still no children. My sister was now in her thirties. Time was running out. I started hunting for yum foods, running as fast as I could to gather up the necessary supplies. She'd already eaten all the wild type foods in the area, so I fired the kiln to make pottery and gathered eggs. I made omelettes and cooked rabbit. We prayed for babies. At 38, she had her first child. A baby boy. We welcomed him, but he did not stay. There were no other babies. Our line had ended, despite our best efforts. I asked my sister if there was anything she wanted to learn or do next and she said that she would like to talk with me. So we stood by the fire and talked a bit, snacking on berries. She was Korean and apologized for her English, but we had no difficulty communicating. We talked about our love of OHOL and I wished her the best in her next life. She took screenshots of the two of us standing together as elders. We got older and older ... eventually, I had to say goodbye. It was time. I could hear the music. I was sorry there had been no children. I think our little camp could have made a nice little village. But it was a good life. The best out of all the lives I'd lived that day. So I'm really glad I said "Y" when my mom asked if I wanted to live and I'm really glad I fought to keep us both alive and together. It was worth it. And, in a way, those short brutal lives made this one special life that much better. You never know which life will be the "best" life. That's one of the beautiful things about this game.

Grim_Arbiter · 2019-05-15 16:34:16

DestinyCall wrote:

I think this is a big part of the situation. If you play OHOL repeatedly for days, weeks, months, years .... you will experience thousands of unique individual lives. But every one of those lives will not be precious and extraordinary. Most of those lives will be similar, even repetitive, maybe boring. The first time you make compost, it is a fun and interesting challenge because you are learning a new skill and gaining mastery over an important job that is helpful to the village. The five hundredth time you spend your life making compost, it just feels like drudgery and you'd probably rather be doing something else, but the village needs dirt and no one else was willing to do the job. If your only major accomplishment in that life was "made a lot of dirt piles", you probably won't look back on your memories of that life and feel nostalgic.
Likewise, the first time you are the last person left alive in a village or the first time you are the victim of a random act of violence or the first time your baby dies in your arms will feel significant and terrible. But the third time it happens, it will start to feel familiar. The thirtieth time it happens it will have become routine. And the three hundredth time you deal with one of these personal tragedies it will have become almost inconsequential. As a new player, you will probably care about each life much more deeply than a veteran player, because each life will bring with it many new experiences. Many things will happen to you for the very first time. Everything is fresh and new. But if you have been playing life after life, you might get to a point where you don't want to play in early villages anymore, because they are all pretty much the same. Or you might reach a point where you don't want to deal with hectic big-city life, because they are messy and full of griefers. Each life is technically a different experience, but if you play enough, each life is pretty much the same ... it follows the same path from start to finish. The lives that really stick with you later are those rare lives where you experience something special or unique. And that just isn't possible every single time you play. Some lives are going to be too short. Other lives are going to be too mundane and uneventful. And still other lives will be too similar to your previous lives.

While I agree with you somewhat, I feel like YOU make every life mean what you want it to mean. Every life I play still feels new and exciting to me.

You gave the dirt pile example, and I have solid memories of doing massive resource making just to see if I could. I still remember a life where I wanted to see how many carrots baskets I could get (before the piles...oh man) and somehow cranked more than I had ever seen but still wasn't satisfied and wanted more carrots. Even other people can remember things like that.. I bet tarr still remembers making his wall of sauerkraut. I sure as hell do and remembering how awe struck I was to find it.

While some lives obviously do blend together, I still have more positive memories than I can even think about. Sitting here now trying to think about them all makes me nostalgic as hell. I'll take the blending bland lives for a chance to get amazing ones anytime.

If you ever feel burnt out take a month break and you'll come back to a different game everytime.

Last edited by Grim_Arbiter (2019-05-15 16:35:24)

RodneyC86 · 2019-05-15 16:47:33

Grim_Arbiter wrote:

DestinyCall wrote:
I think this is a big part of the situation. If you play OHOL repeatedly for days, weeks, months, years .... you will experience thousands of unique individual lives. But every one of those lives will not be precious and extraordinary. Most of those lives will be similar, even repetitive, maybe boring. The first time you make compost, it is a fun and interesting challenge because you are learning a new skill and gaining mastery over an important job that is helpful to the village. The five hundredth time you spend your life making compost, it just feels like drudgery and you'd probably rather be doing something else, but the village needs dirt and no one else was willing to do the job. If your only major accomplishment in that life was "made a lot of dirt piles", you probably won't look back on your memories of that life and feel nostalgic.
Likewise, the first time you are the last person left alive in a village or the first time you are the victim of a random act of violence or the first time your baby dies in your arms will feel significant and terrible. But the third time it happens, it will start to feel familiar. The thirtieth time it happens it will have become routine. And the three hundredth time you deal with one of these personal tragedies it will have become almost inconsequential. As a new player, you will probably care about each life much more deeply than a veteran player, because each life will bring with it many new experiences. Many things will happen to you for the very first time. Everything is fresh and new. But if you have been playing life after life, you might get to a point where you don't want to play in early villages anymore, because they are all pretty much the same. Or you might reach a point where you don't want to deal with hectic big-city life, because they are messy and full of griefers. Each life is technically a different experience, but if you play enough, each life is pretty much the same ... it follows the same path from start to finish. The lives that really stick with you later are those rare lives where you experience something special or unique. And that just isn't possible every single time you play. Some lives are going to be too short. Other lives are going to be too mundane and uneventful. And still other lives will be too similar to your previous lives.
While I agree with you somewhat, I feel like YOU make every life mean what you want it to mean. Every life I play still feels new and exciting to me.
You gave the dirt pile example, and I have solid memories of doing massive resource making just to see if I could. I still remember a life where I wanted to see how many carrots baskets I could get (before the piles...oh man) and somehow cranked more than I had ever seen but still wasn't satisfied and wanted more carrots. Even other people can remember things like that.. I bet tarr still remembers making his wall of sauerkraut. I sure as hell do and remembering how awe struck I was to find it.
While some lives obviously do blend together, I still have more positive memories than I can even think about. Sitting here now trying to think about them all makes me nostalgic as hell. I'll take the blending bland lives for a chance to get amazing ones anytime.
If you ever feel burnt out take a month break and you'll come back to a different game everytime.

Ah, that reminded me that one time I set off on a life mission to gather enough milkweed to make a dozen hand carts - the milkweed part took half my life journey and surviving in isolation
And I finally came home with enough rope to host a bondage party - all I needed was an axe, froe and bowsaw , and the bowdrill - luckily all available

I remember everyone swarming around me in my old age, probably croaking in 5 minutes, but a bunch of younglings helped me with the wheels real quick. Then it was a tearful goodbye and I was called a legend.

I guess performing feats is fun

Edit: And then I realized the server wipe came just within a couple of hours after this feat - then my soul is crushed - damnit world why can't i catch a break and feel more accomplished

Last edited by RodneyC86 (2019-05-15 16:49:43)

Crayonless · 2019-05-15 16:49:32

I think simply getting rid of the /die option would help some players stay in more games. It's far too easy to simply cycle through lives until you find the sort of place that you're looking for. And being able to choose your mother and your family is something that a lot of people want, and it would really help with preventing deaths. But you can't start putting in limitations on a game that people are paying to play. Micro-transactions would absolutely ruin the entire thing, and the people who would enjoy the token system are the people who likely already take the time to live a lot of lives in different places without cycling.

RodneyC86 · 2019-05-15 16:51:07

Crayonless wrote:

I think simply getting rid of the /die option would help some players stay in more games. It's far too easy to simply cycle through lives until you find the sort of place that you're looking for. And being able to choose your mother and your family is something that a lot of people want, and it would really help with preventing deaths. But you can't start putting in limitations on a game that people are paying to play. Micro-transactions would absolutely ruin the entire thing, and the people who would enjoy the token system are the people who likely already take the time to live a lot of lives in different places without cycling.

runners cannot be easily solved though, suicidal babies is the most annoying - immersion breaking shit. The worst part is realizing you're losing a foot race with a newborn child.

OHOL babies are fast as ****

Amon · 2019-05-15 17:05:21

Also, on the limited lives thing, doesen't spill a good fortune I have to say . It'll become prime griefing activity to just run around and try kill as many many many people as possible.
Weather it just removes a singular life from them for that hour or costs them $$$.
every thing implemented needs to be looked thoroughly on how to exploit and abuse it or how to turn it around and use it for all it's non intended purposes.

Last edited by Amon (2019-05-15 17:05:48)

Twisted · 2019-05-15 17:29:22

Some other ideas:

You can only spawn in once per minute. If you die young, either by running away, being abandoned, or using the /die command, you'll have to wait a bit. A bit annoying if you get abandoned naturally, but you'd only have to wait about half a minute in that case.
After you die there's a 10 second timer before you can click respawn. If you lived a normal life you have some time to reflect on it and it's not that long to wait, but if you're just suiciding it would be annoying enough to make you think twice next time. Maybe you'd also have some interesting info about your life on the death screen, such as your name, number of kids, amount of food eaten, the item that you crafted the most, stuff like that.
The server only spawns people in 60 times per hour, i.e. once per minute. Basically the same thing as #1, but also annoying to everyone.
Typing /die or using a mod to do it pops up a confirmation prompt of some kind. You have to type in 3 words (same as the twin list) for the /die to work. Faster than just running away most of the time, but still annoying enough that people might be dissuaded from suiciding as hastily as they do now.
Slow down the baby to 10% speed to simulate crawling and make them unable to run away into a bear or something, and make the /die command unusable for the first 30 seconds. If the baby dies within the first 30 seconds and was picked up by the mother at any point it resets the mother's birth cooldown.

Dodge · 2019-05-15 17:41:13

Amon wrote:

Also, on the limited lives thing, doesen't spill a good fortune I have to say . It'll become prime griefing activity to just run around and try kill as many many many people as possible.
Weather it just removes a singular life from them for that hour or costs them $$$.
every thing implemented needs to be looked thoroughly on how to exploit and abuse it or how to turn it around and use it for all it's non intended purposes.

Yeah with the current death rate https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=6462 i agree it would probably be a terrible idea to limit lives.

You would be born, your mom runs away, you're dead, have to wait to get reborn.

Interestingly these kinds of scenario would probably happen way less if "EVERY life precious" but you could still have the case of a griefer mom killing all her kids and make others have to wait to play another life, so these types of issues have to be solved before jumping into something this game changing.

Grim_Arbiter · 2019-05-15 18:03:17

Twisted wrote:

Some other ideas:
You can only spawn in once per minute. If you die young, either by running away, being abandoned, or using the /die command, you'll have to wait a bit. A bit annoying if you get abandoned naturally, but you'd only have to wait about half a minute in that case.
After you die there's a 10 second timer before you can click respawn. If you lived a normal life you have some time to reflect on it and it's not that long to wait, but if you're just suiciding it would be annoying enough to make you think twice next time. Maybe you'd also have some interesting info about your life on the death screen, such as your name, number of kids, amount of food eaten, the item that you crafted the most, stuff like that.
The server only spawns people in 60 times per hour, i.e. once per minute. Basically the same thing as #1, but also annoying to everyone.
Typing /die or using a mod to do it pops up a confirmation prompt of some kind. You have to type in 3 words (same as the twin list) for the /die to work. Faster than just running away most of the time, but still annoying enough that people might be dissuaded from suiciding as hastily as they do now.
Slow down the baby to 10% speed to simulate crawling and make them unable to run away into a bear or something, and make the /die command unusable for the first 30 seconds. If the baby dies within the first 30 seconds and was picked up by the mother at any point it resets the mother's birth cooldown.

I think we have a winrar folks

Spoonwood · 2019-05-15 18:40:38

DestinyCall wrote:

I think this is a big part of the situation. If you play OHOL repeatedly for days, weeks, months, years .... you will experience thousands of unique individual lives. But every one of those lives will not be precious and extraordinary. Most of those lives will be similar, even repetitive, maybe boring. The first time you make compost, it is a fun and interesting challenge because you are learning a new skill and gaining mastery over an important job that is helpful to the village. The five hundredth time you spend your life making compost, it just feels like drudgery and you'd probably rather be doing something else, but the village needs dirt and no one else was willing to do the job. If your only major accomplishment in that life was "made a lot of dirt piles", you probably won't look back on your memories of that life and feel nostalgic.

Hmmm... not so sure I like your example. I'm not arguing against your concept, but compost piles don't have to all get made in one central spot. They can get strategically placed around the farm in multiple sections to help increase efficiency of multiple workers (or the farmer). I'm not so sure that will end up feeling like drudgery, though maybe you already do that and it feels like drudgery, and if so, that's my mistake. At the very least, placement of compost piles I don't think all that simple.

DestinyCall wrote:

Likewise, the first time you are the last person left alive in a village or the first time you are the victim of a random act of violence or the first time your baby dies in your arms will feel significant and terrible. But the third time it happens, it will start to feel familiar.

I agree with all that, so your concept has good support to it.

DestinyCall wrote:

I was born again as a male baby and decided to stick it out this time, but my mother and sister both died. There was another Eve camp nearby, but they spoke a different language from me, so I couldn't ask them if they wanted me to join them. The camp was so new that it probably wouldn't help to give them another mouth to feed and the Eve already had enough children, so I let myself die. I was reborn as an Eve and ran about for a bit, looking for a decent spot while juggling babies, but the nearby areas were mostly picked clean and covered with skeletons from previous failed Eves.

This makes me realize that encouragement for /die exists since some people will sometimes say 'we need girls', apparently with the implication that you should suicide to make it more likely that a girl who lives to fertility and repeats all that will come along.

DestinyCall wrote:

We picked up tools from a dead camp and I made my sister a skirt from rope we found along the way. Later I hunted another seal so we were both properly dressed.

Reed skirt maker, why god why!!!???!! What a use of rope that... I'm just kidding with you Destiny. I'm sure you've heard people discuss reed skirts before and understand the cost well. I've also decided to make a reed skirt when traveling between towns before (I don't need to take a needle or adze from my family to make it, and that milkweed might not get used otherwise) and in low population play.

I enjoyed reading about your play experience Destiny. Thanks for sharing.

GreatShawn · 2019-05-15 22:40:45

Better towns give babies will to stay. If they /die in a good town they will feel the acute pain of losing something, only this time what the suicider will lose is a potentially good and fun life.

spurofthemoment · 2019-05-15 23:04:44

Twisted wrote:

I have an off-the-wall idea. How about this:
Keep track of various statistics and show them on the main menu and on the end of life screen. Make a leaderboard, and every time you die/look at the main menu you see where you stand. Things that encourage playing the game without suicides, and things that give players something to brag about. Some won't care about that, but many will, and for a lot of people it will have a slight psychological effect making them suicide less.
Some stat ideas:
Average life length in the last 30 days (minimum 5 lives to qualify).
Longest old age death streak.
Average grandkids in the last 30 days.

^^^ I will do anything for a streak.

Peaches · 2019-05-16 02:20:02

Limited lives per hour, yes please!
People will whine and scream and complain to the high heavens, but the ones that give a real shoot about the game and aren't just playing for personal projects on the main server will adapt and accept.

spurofthemoment · 2019-05-16 03:31:09

The only issue with that is that I usually die accidentally two or three times before I hit a good life...I think it's just due to me not being experienced enough yet to survive in an Eve town, as an Eve, or when I'm abandoned in a small town, but my general gameplay experience goes like this:

Attempt 1: Ooh, small town -- drat, starved.
Attempt 2: Ooh, I'm an Eve kid! I'm gonna help -- dangit, starved.
Attempt 3 or 4: Oh, okay. Medium/large town...might be a bit boring but I know what I'm doing... (proceeds to live productive life as a farmer or baker until 40-60 yrs old.)

I really do want to live a long life as an Eve or an Eve's child, but until I get more experience through trial and error, I expect this will keep happening. I'm assuming this is pretty par for the course for new players, so how could we make sure that if there's a limit on lives, new players don't get locked out of the game too quickly before they're able to develop enough interest to stick with it? Will there be enough lives per hour that it should be okay? Or do you think new players will be fine with having to wait thirty or so minutes between runs sometimes?

At this point, I'd be fine with it because I'm invested enough in the game. When I first got it, if I'd been locked out after like 3 attempts I might have been a bit annoyed (how will I learn??), but I think I'd have returned. Do you think this would be a common new player response?

DestinyCall · 2019-05-16 04:13:43

Spoonwood wrote:

Reed skirt maker, why god why!!!???!! What a use of rope that... I'm just kidding with you Destiny. I'm sure you've heard people discuss reed skirts before and understand the cost well. I've also decided to make a reed skirt when traveling between towns before (I don't need to take a needle or adze from my family to make it, and that milkweed might not get used otherwise) and in low population play.
I enjoyed reading about your play experience Destiny. Thanks for sharing.

I regret nothing ... viva la reed skirt!

In my defense, at that point, we already had all the fire-making tools and a snare. And we were miles away from where we ended up settling so all the milkweed was just sitting there unused, begging to be turned into a reed skirt. A little bit of clothing can help soften the hunger drain when traveling long distances through hostile environments, so I definitely recommend seal skins and reed skirts for migratory Eves or small children abandoned in the forest. Once you settle, rabbit is the better way to go, obviously. But if you don't have a bone needle yet, your clothing options are quite limited.

It was my pleasure to share. That was a fun and interesting life.

RodneyC86 · 2019-05-16 04:29:27

DestinyCall wrote:

Spoonwood wrote:
Reed skirt maker, why god why!!!???!! What a use of rope that... I'm just kidding with you Destiny. I'm sure you've heard people discuss reed skirts before and understand the cost well. I've also decided to make a reed skirt when traveling between towns before (I don't need to take a needle or adze from my family to make it, and that milkweed might not get used otherwise) and in low population play.
I enjoyed reading about your play experience Destiny. Thanks for sharing.
I regret nothing ... viva la reed skirt!
In my defense, at that point, we already had all the fire-making tools and a snare. And we were miles away from where we ended up settling so all the milkweed was just sitting there unused, begging to be turned into a reed skirt. A little bit of clothing can help soften the hunger drain when traveling long distances through hostile environments, so I definitely recommend seal skins and reed skirts for migratory Eves or small children abandoned in the forest. Once you settle, rabbit is the better way to go, obviously. But if you don't have a bone needle yet, your clothing options are quite limited.

It was my pleasure to share. That was a fun and interesting life.

I actually wonder I it's more viable over a longer term for everyone to just wear straw hats, sheep/seal skin, reed skirts and wooden shoes ( I believe none of these decay)

If a family were to last 100 generations like the recent Bada family did, they would probably have gone through 15 cycles of rabbit furs for everyone, assuming at any give time 10-15 family members are resent , counting BP and full fur set sans seal coat. It's nearly 150 furs need to be caught every 8-9 generations plus 15 seal skins. So I guess it doesnt sound so bad? Or is it really?

Or we could have a town that sanctions a non decaying uniform as above and no one worries about making new clothes , almost ever, barring missing clothes due to people dying far away.

I find the biggest drop in food pip use is in the first few percentage of insulation anyway. I.e, I think being named is double worse than wearing just a loin cloth and boots but it's in turn not quite double worse compared to fully clothed

So the non decay set really already insulates quite well and is more practical over many generations

lychee · 2019-05-16 04:38:12

RodneyC86 wrote:

I actually wonder I it's more viable over a longer term for everyone to just wear straw hats, sheep/seal skin, reed skirts and wooden shoes ( I believe none of these decay)

If a family were to last 100 generations like the recent Bada family did, they would probably have gone through 15 cycles of rabbit furs for everyone, assuming at any give time 10-15 family members are resent , counting BP and full fur set sans seal coat. It's nearly 150 furs need to be caught every 8-9 generations plus 15 seal skins. So I guess it doesnt sound so bad? Or is it really?
Or we could have a town that sanctions a non decaying uniform as above and no one worries about making new clothes , almost ever, barring missing clothes due to people dying far away.
I find the biggest drop in food pip use is in the first few percentage of insulation anyway. I.e, I think being named is double worse than wearing just a loin cloth and boots but it's in turn not quite double worse compared to fully clothed
So the non decay set really already insulates quite well and is more practical over many generations

There's a few different school of thoughts -- one is that a majority of settlements aren't going to last 100 generations, so rather than counting your eggs before they hatch, maybe it's better to focus on keeping your chickens alive as best as possible.

I think this is the idea of why sealskins are usually made into coats -- the extra insulation is better in the short term, and given that most villages don't last 24 hours, staying alive right now is the bigger priority in many people's minds.

Of course, on the other hand, if you feel like your village is going to die and be abandoned, maybe it's better to make the non-perishables -- because it might be 100 years before another eve stumbles upon your abandoned village. Having some non-decayed clothing might be nice for them.

futurebird · 2019-05-16 04:39:02

It's not a terrible idea to switch to clothes that don't decay. The fancy clothing is good that way and on low pop servers it *is* the uniform and you only make a BP if you are going to use it a lot in that life.

In theory putting soil in a BP is supposed to reset it... but I have tested this and I don't think it works...

But the flip-side is that a large town should have a road to the rabbits and about 29389457 traps. No reason to just keep trapping them and stacking them. Just don't sew clothing from fur unless YOU are going to put it on yourself or on a kid right away!

DestinyCall · 2019-05-16 05:07:40

Rabbits are a renewable resource and the snares never break. So the only real cost for rabbit clothing is the thread. Once you have sheep, the thread cost for rabbit gear goes WAY down, so I'd say rabbit gear is definitely worthwhile. Also .. backpacks.

However, if you find that you are in a village without much clothing, straw hats, sheepskins, and wood shoes are a great way to get a little protection for a low cost so you don't have a bunch of nakeds eating through your berries/pies quicker than necessary. They are not the best clothing, but since they last forever and protect against freezing, they are perfect back-up clothing items and good "baby clothes" during a population boom. Any decent player will upgrade when they get the chance, but at least they aren't freezing/starving in the middle of town while they wait for an old person to die.

I don't usually make reed skirts, because the cost of a whole rope is quite steep. Almost any village is better off making rabbit loincloths and a new bucket rather than wasting milkweed on reed skirts. If you are in a position where the reed skirt looks good (very early eve camp), you are generally better off waiting to make four rabbit items (hat, loincloth, shoes) using the four pieces of thread. One reed skirt vs four rabbit items ... the choice is easy. However, if you are wandering naked in the wilds and milkweed is bountiful, there's really no reason to deny yourself. Make a reed skirt and cover your junk. If you make it back to civilization, the skirt can be used by future generations and if you don't make it back alive ... who cares about that one rope you used on a silly skirt? Certainly not you ... cause you're dead.

TheSamWish · 2019-05-17 04:20:14

Can you not do /die tokens? Life tokens sound like a horrible idea.

fatalwolf · 2019-05-17 05:48:27

Just put a cooldown timer for when you are allowed to respawn that increases each time you /die or die before reaching 60. The longer you live the less of a cooldown to respawn, you can also do it in increments up to the age of 60.

When ever you reach 60 it should give you a grace period or reset your cooldown. The respawn cooldown should also only take into effect if you are fed, that way kids that are abandoned dont get the cooldown. To stop run away babies just give babies a slow debuff upon being born so mothers have a chance to either pickup or abandon.

Last edited by fatalwolf (2019-05-17 05:49:01)

Sukallinen · 2019-05-17 13:41:34

Peaches wrote:

Limited lives per hour...

First: one of my lifes and why important to me. Then "suggestion"-part.
--
IDK. One of best lives for me was I caught would-be-runner girl, tried to run twice but I succeeded in saying we have everything and not to worry I'll make sure she'll be ok. Got a smile at that point and she decided to stay.

Turned out she didn't know basics of game, so had always played in ready-made towns. I had other kids, taught her (and some others who seemed to hang around-said it's ok nobody will blame for getting basket of pies when learning-so they followed bit more closely) how to farm, made cart, always return tools etc... She was glad already in early 20's all the time, and in the end and said being sorry for being busy now with her own kids, but I was so proud when she asked kids if they knew how to compost or such, being willing to help. Also asked if I'd be available (with my meagre knowledge) about other stuff if kids want, ofc I was !

Later a son of mine asked where to bury me for being cool, it was about time and I taught him with words how to bury, said please bury someone else, I want to go out as I came in. Dropping last clothes to my daughter's kid - saying time to adventure, won't be back unless find iron vein. Sharp stone, made basket, lived last five mins in the wild.

So every life has different value, no way I knew that would've been one of most interesting ones (I usually ask about teaching in nursery if town's not critical stage).

--SUGGESTION:
Jason, I'd suggest make the monthly-thing (show some stats and such) available, what I (player) have done etc and maybe suggested voluntary donation (based on something there) that doesn't give anything, up to dollar or two. Also this window could have OFFICIAL voting with only results visible for you, questions you want there, maybe what you think people would like the heading of game to be. Only make sure ppl realize cash is just suggestion, no obligation, same with your asking what people see interesting. And no mention/never will be shown anywhere if I paid or not. Never show/store game-life donations. Never show vote results.

See, you have best understanding how much time some seemingly-easy change would take and if it fits your plans etc... And for good's sake take a month's vacation dude !
--
Lastly: a thing for weekly item learned was mentioned, why not ? So some who learned it can craft it later. Nothing special, maybe crafting would result in a bit different cloak or hat with same stats, maybe other stuff. I've played a game from 2000's last year that had this kind of thing-though it was microtransaction/item. I suggest it'd be free.

Learn craft once (during this-item-weekend), if you make it once after that every cloak you make will have a stripe. Not possible to be able to gain ability to craft later. Needs: different sprite, interactions would be same and each item should look mostly similar and have only bit different visual. Rope still shows "rope" and is used as such, but half of it a bit different color. Might even give rise to trade.

Last edited by Sukallinen (2019-05-17 13:43:12)

Draicclan · 2019-05-18 23:20:12

I have to write simply to provide an opinion against "life tokens". The problem we are supposedly talking about, which is making a player born as a baby feel invested from the start of his/her life, would not be solved by this method. People would simply /die to the life they want and get their token in that life. The problem still there. As the game developer said, people usually live out their lives past childhood.

Some bad ideas for preventing players from /die:
1. Option to directly be born as eve in the menu
2. Double popup menu forcing the player to confirm that they wish to die, word it in a way to make the player feel almost guilty doing it (Are you sure? Your family is at a greater risk of dying out... blah blah blah)
3. Death animation for the baby when it /die
4. Penalty for /die
5. Remove /die (unpopular opinion but pleaseeeeeee)

Some bad ideas to make players more invested in a new life:
1. If a player has been born in a village before, they will feel more invested in that life
2. The life they find themselves born into is having some sort of problem, threatening survival (for players like me who enjoy that part of the game and saving the village)
3. The player is within a life he/she prefers (I've heard ideas addressing this in the forums)
4. More social aspects in the game (like emotes which were an amazing addition to the game!), we the community LOVE making, a meaningful, hour-long connection with one another

Personally, I love being born into a village suffering from a water shortage, or where nobody knows how to build Newcomen machines. I feel important, like what I'm doing is important, and enjoy watching the village thrive when I'm done fixing the issue. Being born into a social conflict or strange predicament always spices things up and makes for an amazing story to post on the fourms later on

futurebird · 2019-05-19 00:37:36

Sukallinen wrote:

--SUGGESTION:
Jason, I'd suggest make the monthly-thing (show some stats and such) available, what I (player) have done etc and maybe suggested voluntary donation (based on something there) that doesn't give anything, up to dollar or two. Also this window could have OFFICIAL voting with only results visible for you, questions you want there, maybe what you think people would like the heading of game to be. Only make sure ppl realize cash is just suggestion, no obligation, same with your asking what people see interesting. And no mention/never will be shown anywhere if I paid or not. Never show/store game-life donations. Never show vote results.
See, you have best understanding how much time some seemingly-easy change would take and if it fits your plans etc... And for good's sake take a month's vacation dude !

This suggestion is great! It would give a controlled forum for feedback and capture some of the opinions of people who aren't in the forum or discord.

Also, I think the vacation suggestion is fair. No one can do anything that takes real energy for more than about 10 months without burning out a little. Vacations are important!

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