Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

fatbunny · 2019-05-23 01:39:56

My mother was murdered by an Eve. My aunt killed the eve and about a minute later the same Eve spawned again and murdered my aunt and chased me with a knife until I starved to death. That's insane that the same griefer can spawn right around the same area and murder people repeatedly. I wont play this game any more until the spawn algorithm is changed. Ill just start my own server and change the spawn algorithm. So I dont have to deal with griefing twats who only enjoy ruining other peoples fun.

Kai · 2019-05-23 03:14:54

it's extremely fun to play a life and get harassed by multiple griefing eves during its course.
it happens nearly every life. it's getting ridiculous.
yet if you kill all eves, people lose their shit.
if you don't, you'll get killed or stolen from, or get griefed another way.
build a fence and they'll still get in, someone is going to leave a gate open sooner or later, no matter how many fences you build.
your mom didn't give you access? enjoy being trapped and killed by eve.

what can you do? absolutely nothing, except for hoping you kill them before they do damage.

it's becoming less fun, so much so I'm considering moving on from ohol, and I'm still to decide whether it's because I've been playing for a while or if it's due to the changes.

RodneyC86 · 2019-05-23 04:45:50

Yeah I think the town's should be far enough from each other that it's highly improbable for eves to find one by themselves, but not improbable for a dedicated explorer, especially one on Horseback to find one

pein · 2019-05-23 05:09:47

should spawn eves to low level civs
i was sprite testing and went on warmonger run, quite funny how easy to get in and find a weapon, or find the spoiled daughter who cant even use the only sword of the town

fatbunny · 2019-05-23 19:39:18

I thought I was over reacting yesterday. But I yesterday after my friends entire family was murdered I knew I was right. I'm sick to death of this. Jason you need to have a more concrete solution for this.

Dodge · 2019-05-23 20:14:20

Issue is, how do you get consistent village interaction without eve's being closer?

Imo best solution is a finite map, then it wouldn't matter if eve's are far since villages would interact sooner or later (road building, traveling etc)

Also map culling could be disabled and we wouldn't lose everything we do, due to the map being infinite or culling after 7 days.

Only issue iron is limited atm, so having a finite map would mean forced map reset after a certain point.

Could be done with apocalypse so not really an issue, if the map is big enough for at least a month.

There could even be a monthly wipe in case no apocalypse until there is a solution for iron.

Booklat1 · 2019-05-23 20:37:50

Dodge wrote:

Issue is, how do you get consistent village interaction without eve's being closer?

simple, we stop skipping content and add more means of transportation instead of putting all eves together.

Eves shouldnt be terribly far but not on a short walking distance either

Dodge · 2019-05-23 20:59:03

Booklat1 wrote:

Dodge wrote:
Issue is, how do you get consistent village interaction without eve's being closer?

simple, we stop skipping content and add more means of transportation instead of putting all eves together.

Eves shouldnt be terribly far but not on a short walking distance either

We have horses,cars and planes more transport wont solve the issue...

Have you seen a single road connecting villages even with the new close eve update?

The thing is with an infinite map everything gets lost sooner or later, so making big roads is pointless, same for cars or planes since they get lost eventually.

But with a finite map a car for example even if lost would stay somewhere on the map to be found by someone. So it wouldnt be wasted iron but something that could be found eventually.

futurebird · 2019-05-23 21:15:47

I like the close spawning. I think two other things are the real source of the issue:

-anyone can be Eve by spamming die enough
-you can't curse people who aren't in your family, and griefers don't see getting killed as a deterrent. Eves in general have not much to loose it's not like they have a long line to keep going.

---

Solutions:

Make it possible to curse people not in your family again. The downside is the potential for curse abuse. One idea is that you need to be near someone to curse them. Another downside is that it would (possibly) deter "valid" hostile acts such as an Eve stealing a pie from a town because she's starving.

Make it harder to be Eve. If you are area banned from all places you don't spawn as Eve but cycle back through previous options that you rejected. Or you get a "there are no locations where you can be born wait 5 min and try again" message. This could go with a limit on the number of Eves and some other ideas like making being Eve a reward for living to 60 3 times in a row.

I like the idea of Eve being a reward for living a long life, we need the best players as Eve not the worst.

Tarr · 2019-05-23 21:16:54

Dodge wrote:

Booklat1 wrote:
Dodge wrote:
Issue is, how do you get consistent village interaction without eve's being closer?

simple, we stop skipping content and add more means of transportation instead of putting all eves together.

Eves shouldnt be terribly far but not on a short walking distance either
We have horses,cars and planes more transport wont solve the issue...
Have you seen a single road connecting villages even with the new close eve update?
The thing is with an infinite map everything gets lost sooner or later, so making big roads is pointless, same for cars or planes since they get lost eventually.
But with a finite map a car for example even if lost would stay somewhere on the map to be found by someone. So it wouldnt be wasted iron but something that could be found eventually.

In the current system why would you ever build a town as Eve? Since you are always spawning into an area that's basically desolate besides the nearby town there's no point for you to try to setup a camp. There's a reason why villages connected by long roads worked and that's because they were far enough from each other to not smash each others toes when it came to resources. Basically, classic Eve style is rather dead at the moment replaced with City Eves because ferals have to run a huge distance away from their spawn to even get a shot at actually playing Eve correctly.

I'd rather have a poor mans bell come into existence such as a smoke signal or something to show where players are in relation to each other and have the players decide to connect themselves to others (not likely with all the coming together update stuff but still).

jasonrohrer · 2019-05-24 04:00:41

This is a tough problem to solve.

Finding another village is currently very hard, even with all the close-together spawning. I heard a bell in my last life, and it was over 3K away.

Putting Eves further apart will just make that harder again.

Of course, having Eves close ruins the Eve game, because if they are close to some town, resources are stripped, etc.

BladeWoods · 2019-05-24 04:04:54

I don't think we need to change all eve spawning. Just need something to address someone repeatedly visiting the same town by repeatedly respawning as eve. Limiting the number of eve spawns you get would work.

jasonrohrer · 2019-05-24 05:01:42

There are two issues here. The one about eve griefing is addressed in the other thread.

There's still a problem of Eves (even the ones we want and need) spawning too close to town and not getting a fresh start, because the land is so worked-over.

Over time, this is going to happen around a town, but you still want an Eve to start near there, so a new town can be near the existing town.

Essentially, for towns to be close, you need some "in-fill." New towns sprouting up between towns.

One idea is to have the map broken up into blocks (say... 200x200 or something). When all people die in a block, and the block goes some number of minutes with no people in it, it wipes back to nature, to prepare for a new Eve to spawn there. This would obviously allow for infill between towns, but have the weird effect of deserted towns that used to be between two towns vanishing. It would eliminate the need for us to constantly "walk" across the map to greener pastures.

(But clearing 40,000 tiles is going to be a very expensive database operation... The current map culling is very expensive, but only happens at server startup, when no one is on the server... it takes 4+ minutes on a big map. Probably what we'd need to do is "space-shift" that section of the map to untouched wilderness somewhere else..... so there's a kind of spacial rift there when you walk across the boundary, and you suddenly find yourself in new/different wilderness than what used to be there.)

Another related idea is each Eve on a separate island with a water boundary, and "ports" on the NSEW sides of the island where, once you build a boat or bridge there, will teleport you to the neighboring islands. This would also allow us to stick new islands elsewhere on the map, while still connecting them into holes in the existing mesh of neighboring towns.

But all these changes are a little weird feeling. You used to take your boat to the N and find the gingers. Now you take your boat to the north and find a totally different town....

They also undercut the beauty and mystery of an infinite, lonely map where someone might be out there somewhere, if you could just find them.

futurebird · 2019-05-24 08:43:06

jasonrohrer wrote:

There are two issues here. The one about eve griefing is addressed in the other thread.

Which thread?

pein · 2019-05-24 09:58:58

for a good gameplay, you should find same level or similar to you
you planting berry bushes and an eve drops by? why would she kill the family?

you got swords and large population who is bored of farming? it's not fun to go out and kill primitive people, some resistance needed to make it an actual war

yeah sure, logically why would things move ? but as long as no oe made contact the map chunk gives no information where are you
so if you are on center or side of a circle, doesn't really matter
only matters how close you are in relation to other cities

sure we an build bells and know where we are at but generally that doesn't happen

your blocks of 200 is similar to my sectors idea
doesn't have to be fixed 200x200 but has to cover the map, so as i suggested the 7 biomes should have a center each so make each spawn a viable spot

something like this where the biomes are random but got a useful center tile
limiting the entrance/exit would be also good
now this chunks of map could move together near each other

first maybe place 10 eves in a fixed size map
when all of them die, but one family makes it, move the whole map chunk to a similar level town
attach together the maps, and next time it moves it's bigger
if a family dies out and nothing changes in a long while then the towns can be deleted
each person who lived on that map gets a chance of spawning back once

now this is hard to explain logically once the town has a bell, it should have fixed coordinates
but if you don't know other cities near you, then it doesn't matter if you are at 30000,30000 or 20000,20000
just makes a better gameplay where you assimilate or destroy 10 other families to move on to the next map

this would also mean that if you family dies to other family the map part dies as well, maybe if the other family doesn't claim your city and the population is zero for like 10 hours, then it can be wiped/ moved to an edge location
now this can be rebalanced but lets say
16 eves start on a map, 1 survives this is map A
map B, C,D does the same. when only one family is alive then A and B map is joined, C and D joined
or all four
this tier based structure means that when the city appears next to you, the map had enough chance to advance to similar tech level
so winner of turn II will get neighbours only when others made 2 turns themselves

the losers and ther towns could be a prize for others who won against other 15 eves
to compensate for their late time
they can stil lgo with their own town or choose the lost town and my feeling is that people rather use their own town even if it's worse than the other town which might look better but that's just a hunch, not sure

this pairing could go infinitely so same level eves would find same level starter eves only and owns with swords probably find other towns with swords

also people could be reborn to their chunk of map once to revive the cities who won this "battles"
and losers would die and forgotten and their map forever wiped if the next winners don't choose to take over it
his would serve as a town survey too, if a town and premises is bad in others eyes, goes to graveyard, if people like it more than their own creation and not the bad setup is the issue they lost a war againt others then it can be reused

this makes sense cause we don't have a set time, so setting a place without a time is bad
like when you play at 8:00 a clock, you arent in age 800 you are at 0 as Eve
when you play at 16:00 you got a disaadvantage of 8x60 years, but still in age 0 as a starter Eve

if it goes down in flames then it's even better
maybe you need to set a tower of war or aa tower of merging
if a family is alive and their tower is complete faster the others lose
if they choose the war, then they need to kill everyone in other towns teleported near them
if they chosoe merge then they need to bring more families to their territory to win
if the tower gets built faster then the others tower, then you win and the other map is set for destruction and everyoen must leave it within 3 hours (scavenge the remnants and go)

this way the old towns would feel old, yo uwould know them , you would know that they had a past, they won, they overcame others
this eras would wait other towns to reach same era to brign them ogether so it would be peace time as well

towns would only get wiped if they lose a tower rush and not by fertility, those winner towns on winner map chunks would be revived by the members of that failies who once were there, once everyone who ever was a baby there has a second chance no more chance of reviving it

Tarr · 2019-05-24 11:01:26

I really dislike the idea of constantly wiping the map whenever a family dies as one of the better parts of the game is watching a place grow over days and potentially weeks. Today was not a good day looking at the family tree: our top deepest root topped out at an abysmal 22 generations and the lowest was 14. On the flip not too long ago we just hit 100+ gen family not too long ago so it's clear that while a rarity it's possible to actually last longer than a day.

I'd much rather see boats and ports than basically suffer a mini-apocalypse every single day. At the very least then players would have the option on whether they want to invite others into their area (open port vs closed port.) Though, this probably wouldn't feel right as you would almost never want to trade/interact with other families unless for roleplay reasons or because you're searching for a female for your island. I still don't think this would be the best option though as it would feel weird for the game to suddenly have some sort of sailing added.

I think some sort of poor mans bell tower would offer a sort of way to get players to meet without spending 18+ hours for them to interact with a second group of players. By the time you have a bell you don't need other players unless it's for repopulation or for murdering as we've seen bells be used for as of late. Before you ripped out the coordinates leak again we could see that as long as you weren't on the extreme edges of the spiral it was possible to walk to another town without too much trouble, but most people don't travel that far out from town.

jasonrohrer · 2019-05-24 15:12:55

You would open the port if your island was stripped of some of the necessary resources for long-term survival, right? Maybe you've got no oil, but plenty of iron, for example.

But the island version of this would be the same as the on-map version with chunks being wiped (because the island to the N would be wiped and replaced with a fresh island for a new Eve to build a different city there).

I'm curious about why the longevity has fallen so precipitously since the come together update. Obviously, inter-village violence is not helping, but I'm guessing that the natural resources have been stripped everywhere, so people are simply running out of stuff. 22 gens is only 5 hours.

Also, family tree front page is super slow right now.... ugg... It's today's long lines that's taking a long time. Gotta optimize that query.

Potjeh · 2019-05-24 15:14:23

Yup, iron is basically non-existent. You really need to implement iron mine tiers analogous to well tiers for this to work.

futurebird · 2019-05-24 15:24:31

jasonrohrer wrote:

I'm curious about why the longevity has fallen so precipitously since the come together update. Obviously, inter-village violence is not helping, but I'm guessing that the natural resources have been stripped everywhere, so people are simply running out of stuff. 22 gens is only 5 hours.

It's those things you mentioned but also being an Eve in an abandon town where most major projects have been completed and your job is to repair and improve just isn't as appealing to many players. I really like it myself, but people complain of being "bored" since to them the main milestones in the game are

-get sheep
-first pump
-diesel engine

These are now much improved since the water update and more people are involved in the later stages. But, there isn't anywhere OBVIOUS to go after making the diesel engine in the view of many players. I expect that some kind of next tier way to get more iron would be the obvious next step. Everyone understands that iron is short so people would work for it.

But back to the main point if you are an Eve and take over an abandon town, your kids will be "done" with the major game play much sooner and then families just kind of self destruct. The urgency is gone because your only major problem is running out of iron and there isn't anything obvious to do about that where you can work together (spending your whole life on a horse to get a distant vein isn't very "multi-player" )

Kai · 2019-05-24 15:27:15

jasonrohrer wrote:

Finding another village is currently very hard, even with all the close-together spawning.

I find that this isn't true.
Especially as eve.
Easy enough to follow the signs of life/activity.
I've seen eves poof into existence just outside de facto town borders.
Not that hard as a town dweller either, especially with access to horse.

Both the frequency and distance of eve spawns should be adjusted in some way.

I don't think the scarcity of iron is why longevity has fallen (partial reclamation from broken tools might help? tinder & scrap iron/steel). I'd attribute that to the increased rate of murders and griefing.

jasonrohrer · 2019-05-24 15:36:20

I'm not seeing murder as the cause for the end of these long lines.

Here's a recent long line ending:

http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … id=4569581

"I have dedicated my life to restoring this village"

None of them died by murder.

pein · 2019-05-24 15:48:28

update hoppers, trying out features?
you still didn't limited the eves, and they can play an aggressive style of take overs, which can wipe a line
generally people just too aimless to do anything, most lifes im the only one who keeps up a fire and runs the compost

Dodge · 2019-05-24 16:36:46

jasonrohrer wrote:

I'm not seeing murder as the cause for the end of these long lines.
Here's a recent long line ending:
http://lineage.onehouronelife.com/serve … id=4569581
"I have dedicated my life to restoring this village"
None of them died by murder.

Now that lineage ban has been fixed, i suspect it's too many eve's causing other lineages to die by taking players from other villages.

Could be interesting to see number of lineages on server when a lineage dies.

Saolin · 2019-05-24 16:50:14

The one time I spawned as an Eve (I think it was shortly after an apocalypse) I laid some supplies down by my well site, went scouting, ran into another eve not far away. She followed me back to my well site where I found another eve there laying down supplies. Since the three of us were unable to understand each other, there was no way to coordinate anything or communicate locations of resources. With three of us having kids we quickly burned through nearby food and died out.

Also I'd like to add that in general I'd prefer not to run into other towns, as the only thing I could see coming from it is war.

Last edited by Saolin (2019-05-24 17:00:03)

futurebird · 2019-05-24 16:57:02

Saolin wrote:

I think competition for limited resources might be the problem with towns not lasting as long. Also if you want towns connecting, which is a neat idea, there needs to be some kind of actual benefit, as currently I can't see it leading to anything other than war. Unless that's the intention.

The benefit, one that people tend to overlook, is simply having *more people* You can get more done if you have more people. As critical as population is to a town surviving it isn't currently balanced by how nervous we feel not being able to curse other families.

And really if I have lived side by side with a family long enough that we speak the same language, nurse each other's kids and have built the town together WHY ON EARTH wouldn't curses work???? Perhaps adding marriage and making the ability to curse tied to knowing each others language would give us a reason to RELLLY "come together"

One Hour One Life Forums

#1 2019-05-23 01:39:56

Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#2 2019-05-23 03:14:54

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#3 2019-05-23 04:45:50

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#4 2019-05-23 05:09:47

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#5 2019-05-23 19:39:18

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#6 2019-05-23 20:14:20

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#7 2019-05-23 20:37:50

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#8 2019-05-23 20:59:03

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#9 2019-05-23 21:15:47

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#10 2019-05-23 21:16:54

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#11 2019-05-24 04:00:41

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#12 2019-05-24 04:04:54

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#13 2019-05-24 05:01:42

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#14 2019-05-24 08:43:06

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#15 2019-05-24 09:58:58

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#16 2019-05-24 11:01:26

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#17 2019-05-24 15:12:55

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#18 2019-05-24 15:14:23

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#19 2019-05-24 15:24:31

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#20 2019-05-24 15:27:15

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#21 2019-05-24 15:36:20

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#22 2019-05-24 15:48:28

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#23 2019-05-24 16:36:46

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#24 2019-05-24 16:50:14

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

#25 2019-05-24 16:57:02

Re: Can we change how close Eves spawn to each other?

Board footer