Thoughts on baskets

testo · 2019-05-30 08:31:55

Tarr wrote:

RodneyC86 wrote:
testo wrote:
To be fair to Jason´s post, the solution to wheat is not to store it as several people proposed. The problem is: theres too much grain unused in the farms. Solution is not to store it.
The basic original problem is: wheat in town is grown for straw mostly with grain as a by-product and not the other way around (like in real life). There will be always a surplus of grain as long as you grow wheat for the compost and not for the grain. Stackable wheat and barrels will end up unused anyways under this analysis.
Easier solution? Make compost craftable from full wheat and straw only. That way you will get compost everytime and grain whenever you need it.
Am I doint it right?
Plausible, or they could let bread stack, or at least let unsliced bread storable. Then people can yoink out one to put on a plate for cutting later. I hate seeing 12 plates of plates of sliced bread sitting in the open.
Or maybe the problem is we are all too anal retentive? (Nah)
Issue is Jason picked the weirdest solution to the problem. If we're making too much wheat should we either lose it, store It, or produce less?
Producing less seems good on paper but is way too expensive to actually do with his solution thus this is obviously not the correct solution to our actual problem.
Letting players store overproduced wheat allows for players to clean up the giant fields of wheat. However, if players aren't using the wheat as is then what's the point of storing It? You'll just keep making barrels and never run out. So this is also not a good solution.
Allowing thrashed wheat to naturally despawn means players can produce whatever they actually need while having the game naturally remove the excess. This encourages players to bake more or they'll lose their potential food. This is by far the easiest and best solution while not taking much work to implement.

Can we agree that the base of the problem is wheat is grown becuase of the straw for compost and grain is just a by product unlike real life?

futurebird · 2019-05-30 08:34:38

Whatever wrote:

Imagine how nice it would be if you could store a lot of wheat at one tile in the bakery, maybe next to it a bucket of water.

That would be amazing.

Tarr · 2019-05-30 08:37:40

Well yeah the root of the problem comes from free mutton pies being a byproduct of composting cycle which is 100% required for the long term health of a town. Wheat and mutton will always be somewhat problematic as long as they are basically *free*

testo · 2019-05-30 09:05:53

Tarr wrote:

Well yeah the root of the problem comes from free mutton pies being a byproduct of composting cycle which is 100% required for the long term health of a town. Wheat and mutton will always be somewhat problematic as long as they are basically *free*

I fear this thread could bring the biggest nerf to pies ever. Like, pies: only 2 uses.

Kai · 2019-05-30 09:11:50

biofuel

/thread

mrbah · 2019-05-30 09:37:22

the wooden slot box seems to be a permanent storage, what seems to be the problem?

MultiLife · 2019-05-30 09:53:19

How does thread turn into a basket?
With witchcraft?
That is odd.

Tarr · 2019-05-30 10:08:38

mrbah wrote:

the wooden slot box seems to be a permanent storage, what seems to be the problem?

Holds ten small items. A box with four basket holds twelve items and the baskets don't decay which means the slot box is dead on arrival. It costs the same as 1.5 boxes rope wise, is harder on steel, and has to be redone if you want to move it.

Slot box basically arrived as dead content due to making baskets permanent. It's one niche is it is less clicks but in a game like ohol one less click so not worth more materials. The sort of thing you would want them for doesn't fit in them so overall they're a more expensive downgrade to storage.

mrbah · 2019-05-30 10:38:13

Tarr wrote:

mrbah wrote:
the wooden slot box seems to be a permanent storage, what seems to be the problem?
Holds ten small items. A box with four basket holds twelve items and the baskets don't decay which means the slot box is dead on arrival. It costs the same as 1.5 boxes rope wise, is harder on steel, and has to be redone if you want to move it.
Slot box basically arrived as dead content due to making baskets permanent. It's one niche is it is less clicks but in a game like ohol one less click so not worth more materials. The sort of thing you would want them for doesn't fit in them so overall they're a more expensive downgrade to storage.

I thought baskets did decay.

Tarr · 2019-05-30 10:59:43

They were having the time upped but then last minute decided to remove then decaying which basically killed the slot box before its release.

Starknight_One · 2019-05-30 11:27:03

MultiLife wrote:

How does thread turn into a basket?
With witchcraft?
That is odd.

Macrame.

MultiLife · 2019-05-30 11:32:30

Starknight_One wrote:

MultiLife wrote:
How does thread turn into a basket?
With witchcraft?
That is odd.
Macrame.

Those look really floppy, fabric-y, unless processed somehow, or wrapped around something harder. And from one thread?

Starknight_One · 2019-05-30 11:46:12

MultiLife wrote:

Starknight_One wrote:
MultiLife wrote:
How does thread turn into a basket?
With witchcraft?
That is odd.
Macrame.
Those look really floppy, fabric-y, unless processed somehow, or wrapped around something harder. And from one thread?

Show me a rope made from two threads. We're dealing with abstracts.

Depending upon how stiff the base cord is, and how tightly it's knotted, macrame can be loose and flowing or fairly stiff. There's still some flex, of course, but you'll have that with any textile product. It works well for carry-bags; I think my mom still has the one she made when I was a kid, 40+ years ago.

testo · 2019-05-30 11:51:00

Tarr wrote:

mrbah wrote:
the wooden slot box seems to be a permanent storage, what seems to be the problem?
Holds ten small items. A box with four basket holds twelve items and the baskets don't decay which means the slot box is dead on arrival. It costs the same as 1.5 boxes rope wise, is harder on steel, and has to be redone if you want to move it.
Slot box basically arrived as dead content due to making baskets permanent. It's one niche is it is less clicks but in a game like ohol one less click so not worth more materials. The sort of thing you would want them for doesn't fit in them so overall they're a more expensive downgrade to storage.

Nah they are ok. Slot box looks cooler and it´s not like one or a few threads will kill a town. It is a little more expansive alternative true, but useful if you are not close to a big swamp. Dead content is pine walls, or dogs. Even track carts are worst, resource wise. Unless someday we have turning tracks.

Tarr · 2019-05-30 11:59:17

I don't really consider a box downgrade anything more than dead content. It's 1.5x the milkweed requirement, more iron tool usage with saws being one of the easiest tools to break, and is a strict downgrade.

There's nothing to vouche for the things in a game that could be classified as a tedium simulator. Swapping from two clicks to one click for less space (or more depending on if you right click through the whole thing vs just clicking what you want) is not useful at all.

These are without a doubt useless and if people,see slot boxes they should turn them to sledges and take the thread for a second box.

Without decaying baskets you should never have to worry about baskets and if you do either grow some wheat or take a cart to the local prairie to make,some.

testo · 2019-05-30 13:22:37

Tarr wrote:

I don't really consider a box downgrade anything more than dead content. It's 1.5x the milkweed requirement, more iron tool usage with saws being one of the easiest tools to break, and is a strict downgrade.
There's nothing to vouche for the things in a game that could be classified as a tedium simulator. Swapping from two clicks to one click for less space (or more depending on if you right click through the whole thing vs just clicking what you want) is not useful at all.
These are without a doubt useless and if people,see slot boxes they should turn them to sledges and take the thread for a second box.
Without decaying baskets you should never have to worry about baskets and if you do either grow some wheat or take a cart to the local prairie to make,some.

See this is where I think the strict mentallity of 100% efficiency doesn´t work. It´s a game. If we wanted 100% efficiency we would probably only eat pies. If I wanted 100% efficiency I would be working at home not playing a game lol.

RodneyC86 · 2019-05-30 13:29:00

testo wrote:

Tarr wrote:
I don't really consider a box downgrade anything more than dead content. It's 1.5x the milkweed requirement, more iron tool usage with saws being one of the easiest tools to break, and is a strict downgrade.
There's nothing to vouche for the things in a game that could be classified as a tedium simulator. Swapping from two clicks to one click for less space (or more depending on if you right click through the whole thing vs just clicking what you want) is not useful at all.
These are without a doubt useless and if people,see slot boxes they should turn them to sledges and take the thread for a second box.
Without decaying baskets you should never have to worry about baskets and if you do either grow some wheat or take a cart to the local prairie to make,some.
See this is where I think the strict mentallity of 100% efficiency doesn´t work. It´s a game. If we wanted 100% efficiency we would probably only eat pies. If I wanted 100% efficiency I would be working at home not playing a game lol.

I agree, the slotted boxes I tried using just now. Its actually quite cool i don't have to pick up a basket (1) , set it on ground (2), pick item I want (3) , store item in BP (4) , pick basket back up (5), then bonk it back in (6)

I just take what I want from a slot box c\(1) then store in bp (2), quite a joy to use. so its more like 6click vs 2 click ? Unless I'm missing something and i shouldnt need 6 clicks. with classic wooden box an basket

I know its a small difference in time, pros can do the 6 click sequence in 1 second. My fingers are slow and i typically need 2-3 seconds for 6 clicks. If i use the box 10 times i my life i might spare time to plant some extra milkweeds in that 30 seconds maybe?

But yes, baskets not decaying made this box much more meh than it should really be..

Last edited by RodneyC86 (2019-05-30 13:29:49)

Tarr · 2019-05-30 13:57:33

testo wrote:

Tarr wrote:
I don't really consider a box downgrade anything more than dead content. It's 1.5x the milkweed requirement, more iron tool usage with saws being one of the easiest tools to break, and is a strict downgrade.
There's nothing to vouche for the things in a game that could be classified as a tedium simulator. Swapping from two clicks to one click for less space (or more depending on if you right click through the whole thing vs just clicking what you want) is not useful at all.
These are without a doubt useless and if people,see slot boxes they should turn them to sledges and take the thread for a second box.
Without decaying baskets you should never have to worry about baskets and if you do either grow some wheat or take a cart to the local prairie to make,some.
See this is where I think the strict mentallity of 100% efficiency doesn´t work. It´s a game. If we wanted 100% efficiency we would probably only eat pies. If I wanted 100% efficiency I would be working at home not playing a game lol.

There's no reason for the things to exist if they're strictly worse in every respect minus taking a click or two off the whole process. Something like a spring door is more costly than a normal door but auto shutting is incredibly valuable. Making an item that holds less while cutting a max of four clicks is just being wasteful. Sure you have an hour to live but those five seconds aren't a break or make moment.

As a reminder it takes like 26 steps to make a fire so removing an item from a chest being five to six steps vs two is a pretty minimal time save.

I'd argue the opposite that by making all your boxes to slot boxes you're trying to be too efficient to the point where the return isn't worth the cost. Depending on how you retrieve an item from either box can lead up to nine clicks either way.

I don't see value in saving fractions of a second when the cost is essentially half of another box + more iron usage.

Last edited by Tarr (2019-05-30 14:37:07)

puddleofsick · 2019-05-30 14:34:55

I bet if a silo made it in, we'd build them. Of course just letting us pile it up is also an option.

Spoonwood · 2019-05-30 16:31:44

testo wrote:

Tarr wrote:
I don't really consider a box downgrade anything more than dead content. It's 1.5x the milkweed requirement, more iron tool usage with saws being one of the easiest tools to break, and is a strict downgrade.
There's nothing to vouche for the things in a game that could be classified as a tedium simulator. Swapping from two clicks to one click for less space (or more depending on if you right click through the whole thing vs just clicking what you want) is not useful at all.
These are without a doubt useless and if people,see slot boxes they should turn them to sledges and take the thread for a second box.
Without decaying baskets you should never have to worry about baskets and if you do either grow some wheat or take a cart to the local prairie to make,some.
See this is where I think the strict mentallity of 100% efficiency doesn´t work. It´s a game. If we wanted 100% efficiency we would probably only eat pies. If I wanted 100% efficiency I would be working at home not playing a game lol.

No, you wouldn't only eat pies. You would always yum, and always drink milk once buckets were up for milk (and that would happen fairly fast). Eggs from goose ponds would be even more of a staple and people wouldn't drain ponds. Turkeys would be even more of a staple, if that's possible. Berries from wild bushes close enough to town would always get brought back to camp. And probably a little less composting, and a little more of the fertile soil pits close to camp used (and they would probably get dug up). Maximum efficiency is the most efficient foods not considering yum in addition to everyone yumming as much as possible. It's more complex than just eating pies.

testo · 2019-05-30 17:35:04

Spoonwood wrote:

testo wrote:
Tarr wrote:
I don't really consider a box downgrade anything more than dead content. It's 1.5x the milkweed requirement, more iron tool usage with saws being one of the easiest tools to break, and is a strict downgrade.
There's nothing to vouche for the things in a game that could be classified as a tedium simulator. Swapping from two clicks to one click for less space (or more depending on if you right click through the whole thing vs just clicking what you want) is not useful at all.
These are without a doubt useless and if people,see slot boxes they should turn them to sledges and take the thread for a second box.
Without decaying baskets you should never have to worry about baskets and if you do either grow some wheat or take a cart to the local prairie to make,some.
See this is where I think the strict mentallity of 100% efficiency doesn´t work. It´s a game. If we wanted 100% efficiency we would probably only eat pies. If I wanted 100% efficiency I would be working at home not playing a game lol.
No, you wouldn't only eat pies. You would always yum, and always drink milk once buckets were up for milk (and that would happen fairly fast). Eggs from goose ponds would be even more of a staple and people wouldn't drain ponds. Turkeys would be even more of a staple, if that's possible. Berries from wild bushes close enough to town would always get brought back to camp. And probably a little less composting, and a little more of the fertile soil pits close to camp used (and they would probably get dug up). Maximum efficiency is the most efficient foods not considering yum in addition to everyone yumming as much as possible. It's more complex than just eating pies.

Lol whatever, my point was: I don´t really care about 100% efficiency, thus, I can accept a lower efficiency for slot boxes, as long as it is not *that bad. I wonder if 100% efficiency could be reached anyways. Is not part of the game stochastic?

And @Tarr: I couldn´t care less about more or less clicks. Slot boxes may not be most efficient, but I´ll build them anyways becuase I like them. They look cool to me and they are useful.

Tarr · 2019-05-30 18:08:03

While you may not care whether or not an update is good some of us would rather stuff be introduced in a useful state. When rails were originally released people were just as ecstatic about the new content but it was slow and janky until later buffed.

Regardless of how you think these things are less useful than what we have had previously which is just plain silly. We've had a single storage update since the game was released last year that was an actual upgrade to our storage system and that was by adding rubber wheels to carts.

You're welcome to make slot boxes, and you're welcome to think they're good, however that doesn't change the fact they're downgrades to stuff we already have in game. Pointing out their flaws is an attempt to get Jason to buff the things instead of adding more dead content.

Saolin · 2019-05-30 19:09:34

Can we still make baskets with two straw? If so these changes seem like an upgrade to storage possibilities, something a lot of people have been asking for. Obviously some the new content, thread baskets and slot boxes, aren't particularly great, but I think there's more benefits here than negatives if I'm understanding this update correctly.

Tarr · 2019-05-30 19:14:58

Saolin wrote:

Can we still make baskets with two straw? If so these changes seem like an upgrade to storage possibilities, something a lot of people have been asking for. Obviously some the new content, thread baskets and slot boxes, aren't particularly great, but I think there's more benefits here than negatives if I'm understanding this update correctly.

Yes, you can still make all the old stuff the same way. Being able to store bowl items in normal boxes is a great change in the clutter department, however we still need to be able to dump out bad items (sooner rather than later).

The new box and new way way to make baskets are both traps and should either be buffed (More items for the box, allow ball of thread or at least needle and thread to make baskets.) Or in the case of the basket thing just removed it not buffed as it's an easy way to grief.

Dodge · 2019-05-30 19:19:15

Im not sure why he doesn't want to add actual furniture like tables,closets etc

But i think it's because it could be potentially used to block entrances and other griefing related stuff

If that's the reason there needs to be a solution to that problem.

Maybe being able to elect a town mayor or achitect and only him could move/destroy/modify these objects could be a solution.

Similar to how the gates have owners

One Hour One Life Forums

#26 2019-05-30 08:31:55

Re: Thoughts on baskets

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Re: Thoughts on baskets

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