More Dehumanization

FishRfriendsnotfood · 2020-03-08 23:04:19

Solbusaur wrote:

Spoonwood wrote:
Move on with your lives and do something else with your time! And don't play this game... ever again! Or try to dissuade others from playing by one means or another!
I predict that you'll have a better life if you stop playing and never play this game again.
T h e n w h y a r e y o u s t i l l h e r e ?

I've asked that same question. And he said I was attacking him by making claims I want him not to exist. Just letting you know since if he accuses me of 'attacking' him then he should do the same with you. Gotta be fair when you're spreading your crazy.

Spoonwood · 2020-03-08 23:05:12

JackTreehorn wrote:

You seem to be posting the same thing over and over again, maybe it's time you take your own advice.

Pretty sure I was trying to dissuade people from playing.

Spoonwood · 2020-03-08 23:06:24

Jojigirl wrote:

Spoonwood wrote:
Move on with your lives and do something else with your time!
I suggest you take your own advice!

I have been doing things with my time other than playing.

Jojigirl wrote:

I predict that you'll have a better life if you stop stalking a game that you do not like and never think about this game again!

I'm pretty sure I haven't been stalking a game.

Spoonwood · 2020-03-08 23:07:24

Solbusaur wrote:

Spoonwood wrote:
Move on with your lives and do something else with your time! And don't play this game... ever again! Or try to dissuade others from playing by one means or another!
I predict that you'll have a better life if you stop playing and never play this game again.
T h e n w h y a r e y o u s t i l l h e r e ?

To dissuade people with respect to playing.

Spoonwood · 2020-03-08 23:23:44

FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:

I've asked that same question. And he said I was attacking him by making claims I want him not to exist.

No. Don't recall saying that you said that to me. You said that someone else shouldn't exist, and a moderator saw it also on the discord.

FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:

Just letting you know since if he accuses me of 'attacking' him then he should do the same with you. Gotta be fair when you're spreading your crazy.

Well let's see here... Fish said:

FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:

you continue to be a vainglorious gasbag

https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 717#p90717

Fish said this:

FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:

... Like a baby that wants a pacifier and cries about it, that's the characteristics I can attribute to you: a whiney little baby without it's pacifier. Jason please tell me you are better than this obvious troll being obvious.

https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 346#p90346

Fish wrote this, again directed at me:

FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:

But did you die?

Also, this comment:

FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:

How long did it take you to type that post. Asking for research purposes. You made the entire 2 paragraphs prior to your last sentence, redundant.

https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 283#p90283

FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:

Spoon....you are tripping over your own illusory superiority.

https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 128#p90128

Here's Fish telling me what my state of being is:

FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:

Find a new hobby spoon, you're tired.

https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 004#p90004

Here's more:

FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:

God why would I want to, you're insufferable

https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 100#p89100

Léonard · 2020-03-08 23:36:33

testo wrote:

Do you follow the patern? Every step is about 3 to 4 times the step before. That is obviously related to the needs of a growing town.
[...]
I say the problem is in the second part of my last sentence: there is nothing else to do, meaning exaclty what everyone has been telling from six months ago: WE NEED CONTENT.

Wait another month and you can make it a whole year.
At least as far as I can tell from my own posting history.

This started after the property fences update.
Which was the very first sign that Jason wanted to abandon the idea of making tech-related content and try and make contrived mechanics to impose trade and what not.
Which was a big surprise to me then. I mean, even the people playing could and still do feel to this day that this isn't how natural progression should go.
We shouldn't jump from small, 20 people villages to private property and trade just like that. And that fit the theory I lay out in my post.

testo wrote:

Of course you only argue about a number because a small group of people think the game is "not challenging" if there is no scarcity. In this sense this game has progressibely abandon its premise from civilization building to surviving.

I also have a bit of a theory on this which I cannot directly prove, so take what I'm going to say with a grain of salt.

But recently I began to think that these people are also the kind of people who really don't care that much at all about the crafting part of the game.
I mean, they fundamentally don't see the appeal in building things (like civilization) and as such reject the idea that adding more craftable content could be the solution.
They'd be the kind of people who would say, for example, "I never tried to make an oil rig or an engine, looks too complicated to me".

Of course this is a gross generalization of people, so feel free to prove me wrong if you think you're an exception to this.

Jason also seems to fall into this category according to me.
One of his usual arguments is that before all of this he had been steadily adding more and more content to the game, only to notice that people "didn't trade, go into war or have private properties".
I mean, at first glance you can sort of see how he could be right, but this fails to take in account the fact that we're talking about meaningful, tech-related content.
Jason really likes to completely disregard that part of the argument. Presumably out of laziness.
Isn't most of the oil stuff way, way older than just a year at this point? Yeah. Pretty old.
It also fails to disprove this theory I have which is that we needed a bunch more tech-related updates before these things could start to emerge naturally in some primitive form at the very least.
In other words, maybe we stopped the content updates too early.

Another one of his patented arguments is the player numbers.
I admit this is kind of unrelated as it was originally made in order to disprove the idea that these non-content updates have been driving players away.
But don't you see how cynical it is?
The idea is that the "player numbers have been dwindling down, are dwindling and will always be dwindling down".
Great! We've proven nothing! We're running in circles now!
This exactly proves nothing regarding the quality of the updates or the validity of the basic idea behind them.

The only thing that's changed is the general satisfaction regarding the updates.
And the only theory that hasn't been tested within this unproductive and hellish year of OHOL updates is the one that, you guessed it, asks for more content.

sigmen4020 · 2020-03-08 23:41:03

Spoonwood wrote:

JackTreehorn wrote:
You seem to be posting the same thing over and over again, maybe it's time you take your own advice.
Pretty sure I was trying to dissuade people from playing.

Can you give me your success rate on that? I doubt it's very impressive.

fug · 2020-03-08 23:55:15

testo wrote:

I don´t usually follow Spoonwoods train of thought, but in this case the amount of water produced per oil is in my opinion not the problem.
If we expect a town to develop any sensible way of actual civilization (just as the premise of the game) we have to expect a water and resources surplus and not the other way around. Big cities and empires benefited in some way or another from resource abundance and not from scarcity. Given that oil is a) Region limited and scarce b)Hard to find and c)Non renewable i´d say there is no problem with that much water.
Of course you only argue about a number because a small group of people think the game is "not challenging" if there is no scarcity. In this sense this game has progressibely abandon its premise from civilization building to surviving. I you truly believe in the premise about civilization then you should recheck the numbers:
Shallow well 1.3 cistern average
Deep well 3.3 cisterns average
Newcomen pump 12.3 cisterns average.
Do you follow the patern? Every step is about 3 to 4 times the step before. That is obviously related to the needs of a growing town.
Now we are facing a drop from 46 to 26 cisterns worth of value in water from an oil rig.
Why? Because people like you find it boring and unchallenging when theres too much water and nothing else to do.
I say the problem is in the second part of my last sentence: there is nothing else to do, meaning exaclty what everyone has been telling from six months ago: WE NEED CONTENT.
If we had a nice way to use the water in construction, crafting, art, cooking and others there would be nobody bored about too much water. If we had a decent alternative to use kerosene (cars and planes are laughable) then we would have an actual choice in terms of water or "something else". But no, nerfing water is the best way to keep everyone on their toes and doing something before they note we haven´t had a tech improvement since a year or so.
Seriously, I love Jasons latest attempts to fix old stuff but this is a big dump on everything.
Do you really think nerfing food bonus and dropping about 50% water from the oil rig is "boiling the frog"?

Food bonus wise the server has been fine on ripping it off for months as can be seen by myself and others talking about it. At the point 50+ berry bushes is sustainable for multiple weeks it means there's literally zero pressure what so ever on a big town. People have zero idea what so ever where their water is coming from, how they got it, or who is even doing it in the first place. If in Jason's vision of the game places die then oil is the thing that has to kill it.

I'm by no means here to be the fun police and say the game has to be X hard and has to be played Y way but I was specifically asked what is causing towns to never die and it's how much water is produced by oil. If people can comfortably live on berry bushes even when they're 4 pips a bite that says water is much MUCH too plentiful. Saying we need all these extra resources are needed for towns to develop beyond farming is just clearly not true. Unless you've got a bunch of loafers or an Eve camp you should almost always have more than enough food to go around.

However with food nerfs he should also be buffing stuff like insulation values and dropping the rate of pip loss. The game shouldn't be focused on just eating (lower food values only does this) but should make food costly (raising minimum drain rate while reducing food values). Basically, you eat the whole bush at once but might only need to eat like that every 3-4 minutes.

In regards to boiling the frog I think he should just do it in extremes then reel it back. Pull the scab off with the bandage when you rip instead of slowly pulling back the bandage every few days. Making the game more difficult for the sake of being hard is pretty silly in my opinion though because it never hurts the veteran players. While I'd rather we use water for more tasks than nerf it if he's going for the quick option its to just nerf the thing because content is still a few weeks away.

TL;DR:
Nerf oil + food, raise pip drain rate from 6.8 to 8.8 or whatever you feel is right.
Do things in extremes instead of baby nerfs.
If towns are supposed to die then oil has to eventually run out in a reasonable area.

FishRfriendsnotfood · 2020-03-09 00:07:50

Spoonwood wrote:

FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:
I've asked that same question. And he said I was attacking him by making claims I want him not to exist.
No. Don't recall saying that you said that to me. You said that someone else shouldn't exist, and a moderator saw it also on the discord.
FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:
Just letting you know since if he accuses me of 'attacking' him then he should do the same with you. Gotta be fair when you're spreading your crazy.
Well let's see here... Fish said:
FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:
you continue to be a vainglorious gasbag
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 717#p90717
Fish said this:
FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:
... Like a baby that wants a pacifier and cries about it, that's the characteristics I can attribute to you: a whiney little baby without it's pacifier. Jason please tell me you are better than this obvious troll being obvious.
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 346#p90346
Fish wrote this, again directed at me:
FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:
But did you die?
Also, this comment:
FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:
How long did it take you to type that post. Asking for research purposes. You made the entire 2 paragraphs prior to your last sentence, redundant.
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 283#p90283
FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:
Spoon....you are tripping over your own illusory superiority.
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 128#p90128
Here's Fish telling me what my state of being is:
FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:
Find a new hobby spoon, you're tired.
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 004#p90004
Here's more:
FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:
God why would I want to, you're insufferable
https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 100#p89100

Glad I can affect your life so much. At least you are okay with being a self important trumpeter. Stay irrelevant it suits you.

Spoonwood · 2020-03-09 00:25:12

Leonard wrote:

One of his usual arguments is that before all of this he had been steadily adding more and more content to the game, only to notice that people "didn't trade, go into war or have private properties".

I didn't see anything about war or private properties in either of the advertisements for the game before it came out. I DID find something about 100 new items every week, and 10,000 craftable in game objects. And suggestions of metal cars, mono-rails, and robots.

Spoonwood · 2020-03-09 00:26:14

sigmen4020 wrote:

Can you give me your success rate on that? I doubt it's very impressive.

Nope. I can't give you a success rate. I don't know way of testing my influence in this regard.

Solbusaur · 2020-03-09 00:35:19

I can see this thread getting locked soon, should this continue

Spoonwood · 2020-03-09 00:38:21

fug wrote:

In regards to boiling the frog I think he should just do it in extremes then reel it back. Pull the scab off with the bandage when you rip instead of slowly pulling back the bandage every few days.

Pulling the scab off with the bandage isn't a gradual change. What you've said implies "boiling the frog" as stupid, since such is slow by definition.

Worse you don't seem to give a damn that it dehumanizes you personally.

fug wrote:

While I'd rather we use water for more tasks than nerf it if he's going for the quick option its to just nerf the thing because content is still a few weeks away.

Right, so it seems openly implied several times over that the game designer used misleading ads at best since "content is still a few weeks away", and Mr. Rohrer's claims of "I'll do such later", when such could get put off indefinitely AND when such is completely incompatible with 100 new objects every week as talked about in an advertisement before the game reached the market. Again, get your head out of the sand. Someone using such manipulative tactics doesn't deserve much. Not your time, nor anyone else's. No one should be on such a person's 'side'... not with respect to a game that had misleading ads (and if much of the game industry is like that, then gamers should NOT be on the side of game designers in general also). And people walking away from the game permanently and not looking back is a step in that direction.

FishRfriendsnotfood · 2020-03-09 02:30:46

Spoonwood wrote:

fug wrote:
In regards to boiling the frog I think he should just do it in extremes then reel it back. Pull the scab off with the bandage when you rip instead of slowly pulling back the bandage every few days.
Pulling the scab off with the bandage isn't a gradual change. What you've said implies "boiling the frog" as stupid, since such is slow by definition.
Worse you don't seem to give a damn that it dehumanizes you personally.
fug wrote:
While I'd rather we use water for more tasks than nerf it if he's going for the quick option its to just nerf the thing because content is still a few weeks away.
Right, so it seems openly implied several times over that the game designer used misleading ads at best since "content is still a few weeks away", and Mr. Rohrer's claims of "I'll do such later", when such could get put off indefinitely AND when such is completely incompatible with 100 new objects every week as talked about in an advertisement before the game reached the market. Again, get your head out of the sand. Someone using such manipulative tactics doesn't deserve much. Not your time, nor anyone else's. No one should be on such a person's 'side'... not with respect to a game that had misleading ads (and if much of the game industry is like that, then gamers should NOT be on the side of game designers in general also). And people walking away from the game permanently and not looking back is a step in that direction.

Irony is telling others Jason doesn't deserve their time.....yet devoting all of your time to Jason. It's fun to mock you doug.

pein · 2020-03-09 07:44:42

spoon complains, spoon repeats herself and

jason wont even reply or wont be positive causee you just try to force your own ideas and ideals
you dont like it? we getit, you are not alone, but your rants are boring by now

Testo, my biggest issue with the water system is that you need like 30 rubber to empty the newcommen
I lived a life in a small city which turned out to be near the bell town,the last minutes of my life i got a horse and got the rubber
left it uncooked near the oven
next life i told my mom to go there and i grew hair by the time we arrived, and we started collecting the rubber, and the lady try to kill us over it

i kinda hate how possessive people get over stuff they didn't make. yes, I like the continuity in my games, i do work, i get the results, i want to use up the resources I make, even if I'm another person by that time. and I really hate people hoarding buckets, horses, there is a pattern that some people rather steal everything i make than to make on their own.

I killed that lady cause she persisted to keep all the rubber there, even more than keeping alive that kid, and she refused to communicate even if she understood us. I carried back all the rubber, it was 29 tries to empty that damn newcommen, and i spent all of my life on it even with the tools and knowledge and resources to do the job. ITs plain boring, i just wanted to empty it, i didnt even cared for the water at that point, last 5 minutes just explained a ginger guy with 10 notes how to set up the oil which was close to the town.

Its not really a challenge for the family, its a challenge for a few people, and getting rubber wasn't a challenge to the family either cause the family had no way to do it, ad even if the gingers had one job to do, i had to beg them over and over to do it. Sometimes you will know other families on the map, sometimes you get lucky, its still a lot of dumb people around, and its still a few veterans who rush the tech in a few steps.

It feels like the game has a few levers and Jason thinks that pulling them has a big effect. Sure, you can nerf and buff left and right but isn't really an issue. 0.05 temperature is not a buff. A few buckets of water is not a difference. The ones who can do it will do it the ones who cant wont do it. So its just a 0 and 1 input. Got water? Yes, then water da beri. Got no water? Do nothing. Thats how it feels. Even i had games where i was to annoyed to spend all my life just to get water or iron for the town, rather just raised some kids.

I remember when we were discussing the water system, wasnt fully original idea, but it was my idea to make buckets a restriction and an upgrade at the same time. So higher-tech worth more than low tier wells all over the place. I suggested having water deposits which can deplete and more focus on the transport than on the refresh rates.

The bucket is not usable directly so its a bit weird, the cistern cant be used with bowls anymore which is also weird. I wasnt a big fan of the grid system but actually worked out nicely. Overall the water system hd a good overhaul that time, and the newcommen addition wasn't bad either.
The rift brought a lot of nerfs to water, to a point where composting doesn't even worth it anymore and you can't even teach kids or give them a job.

Overall it wont matter how much he adjusting it. Its still a 0 and 1 system. Veterans will see a tedious process and newbees will see a problem they cant fix. Or maybe once, they will work up their skill and knowledge and make the upgrades once. And that life will be fun. Maybe a few more times they will do it, then its just plain boring. I was the guy who brought buckets of water in a cart, and i still ty to help when someone has the enthusiasm, i still go help people to empty a well into buckets and carry it home, but i also know how hopeless is to communicate with people who just stay home and take it for granted that others fix it. You got a bucket of water? Make some pies and odnt waste it on dumb bushes you dont need, you dont have an income you got a fixed amount.

The real issue is every other tech. Water tech has a few steps: make a shovel and some stones, find a spot. Upgrading isnt too hard usually but still gives a boost to farming. Newcomen seems to be tthe final phase cause people die out or travel before that hppens. Bell towns are kinda rare and engines are also rare. But having oil is even rarer. And so the racial restrictions are dumb cause these things were enjoyable ad at least a bit more valuable. By artificially slowing down the game, we even got less things to do. Its not fun arguing with thieves in their umpa lumpa language that they shouldnt steal the horses and buckets from the town, and its not fun to make the drama over "trading". Its still roleplay to give others rubber, there is not much difference between living in city A instead of city B or C.

We would need other techs to be more expanded.
Like mining the iron should be a few extra steps, like actually pickaxing hills and some random chance to get iron, not ust picking up if you are first. Some chance game wouldnt hurt where you collect stones cause they may contain metals, rather than just pickign them up directly.

I liked the strategy games where the map changed, mountains were gone after you gathered the resources.
Also the systems like stronghold had: cows into cheese and hides, hides into armor, grain into bread, wood into crossbows into money. Stockpiles and quarries, smelting and workshops. Or even better the systems in tropico where raw resouces go trough 2-3 step. cocoa and sugar into chocolate, fruits to juice, mix them, logs into lumber into boats or furniture.

More focus on production and conversion elss focus on gathering.

Thats why OHOL sucks, it has no obs at all and jason even limits us even more. Its totally optional to do anything. No pressure at all. So its too easy. We need mroe invidual pressure and motivation to do things instead of leaching on others.

Spoonwood · 2020-03-09 14:21:03

pein wrote:

jason wont even reply or wont be positive causee you just try to force your own ideas and ideals
you dont like it? we getit, you are not alone, but your rants are boring by now

I'm not and haven't been trying to get a response from Jason.

Jojigirl · 2020-03-09 16:11:07

Spoonwood wrote:

I have been doing things with my time other than playing.
I'm pretty sure I haven't been stalking a game.

You are seriously delusional if you believe that..

It makes make curious though, if you stalk a game forum, the way you have been, on a game that you say that you do not play or like, how are you with the people in your life.. That's actually a little scary to think about.. I bet you got some missing people secrets hidden in that closet of yours..

Spoonwood · 2020-03-09 16:38:22

Spoonwood wrote:

I have been doing things with my time other than playing.
I'm pretty sure I haven't been stalking a game.

Jojigirl wrote:

You are seriously delusional if you believe that..

I've written on a forum and made some comments elsewhere. Neither of which are the game, nor in the game. Also, here's my hash: 9a0589cb673446fd534812d43cde1913f30b256a I've only ever had one account. My recollection is that the last time I logged in, I responded to Fish a bit later in some forum post. I went into the tutorial area and that's the only place I played on public servers, and I played once on a private server in something like the past month (and the private server didn't have Jason's settings). You can check my hash to see how much I've played recently... basically since I've made the 'run away' post, to confirm or deny your claim about me being 'delusional' about my claims.

Alright, now it's clear to me that Jojigirl isn't just saying things she doesn't realize are false, but knowingly engaging in malicious speech.

Last edited by Spoonwood (2020-03-09 16:58:04)

Spoonwood · 2020-03-09 16:55:28

FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:

Irony is telling others Jason doesn't deserve their time.....yet devoting all of your time to Jason.

So, I didn't write this post for Jason. I also didn't write several of my previous posts for Jason.

FishRfriendsnotfood · 2020-03-09 17:05:04

Spoonwood wrote:

FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:
Irony is telling others Jason doesn't deserve their time.....yet devoting all of your time to Jason.
So, I didn't write this post for Jason. I also didn't write several of my previous posts for Jason.

This game wouldn't exist without jason. Literally any post you make on a game you claim to hate, is to jason. You can't be that dim witted to not see the irony.

Spoonwood · 2020-03-09 19:00:52

FishRfriendsnotfood wrote:

Literally any post you make on a game you claim to hate, is to jason.

Was I aware that Jason could and might possibly read what I wrote, when I wrote this post?

Yes.

Did I choose my words and try to communicate ideas on the basis of Jason reading the post?

No.

Also, the whole idea of forced reproduction is rotten to the core. The game is bad. Forced reproduction wasn't something I should have ignored, and people ignoring it make a mistake no matter what they like or dislike.

Also, there's this, which I think speaks for itself and is rather bad since consent gets classed in with nonsense:

jasonrohrer wrote:

This should NOT be a game about mating and consent and all that nonsense

https://onehouronelife.com/forums/viewt … 9266#p9266

DestinyCall · 2020-03-09 19:08:10

We all know that you are a tsundre, Spoonwood. You are so obvious about it.

Just kiss already. The suspense is killing me.

sigmen4020 · 2020-03-09 19:39:25

If you commit the grave sin of playing this video game you are destined for hell.

The only way to repent is to stop playing and pray to your nearest spoon.

Last edited by sigmen4020 (2020-03-09 19:39:48)

karltown_veteran · 2020-03-09 21:57:50

DestinyCall wrote:

We all know that you are a tsundre, Spoonwood. You are so obvious about it.
Just kiss already. The suspense is killing me.

+1 because Spoon totally is

Elsayal · 2020-03-09 22:25:22

I like to teach people how to play in game.
It's not relevant to the subject, but still.

One Hour One Life Forums

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